dog food-does high protein and fat make a dog hotter

jim m · Post by **jim m** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:49 am

does this make a dog hot or not in the summer some say no? some say you can burn them up?

Adam M. O'Donnell · Post by **Adam M. O'Donnell** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:08 am

I feel you can burn a dog up!
I try to stick to a 26/18 in the summer, and a 30/20 in the winter.
Just my opinion!

jim m · Post by **jim m** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:37 am

26-18 is very high for summer?

jdmart · Post by **jdmart** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:22 am

It depends on how much you run your dogs? If you run then 4-5 days a weeks 26-18 is fine in my opinion.

mybeagles · Post by **mybeagles** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:04 pm

They had a nice article in the "Cooner" magazine this month about fat and protein, and I have also read many other articles by vets on this subject. Im real satisfied with the conclusion I came to and the results Im getting....."There is NO vailidated proof of high protein overheating a dog, or the other common argument that it will burn up their kidneys...." the article stated.....
Dogs with genetic defects and poor kidneys are suseptable to all sorts of troubles including kidney failure....this however can not be blamed on high protein dog food.....perhaps on inbreeding but not the dog food, but Ill leave that one alone.....

A vet asked me an interesting question, do humans cut their meat or protein intake in the summer? Then why do you think dogs should? Do you get hot after you eat a steak? Lets get some science in these comments, whats going to burn up?

Another big point of the article was the fact that all 27% protein foods are not the same.....27% if its from undigestible sources may only be 15-18% in reality.....Protein is necessary for disease fighting, muscle growth, skin/coat, and provides some added energy.....From what I can understand, fat content should be of more concern in the summer for dogs that are not being run regularly, and not burning the calories to keep warm...I was told by my Vet that loose stools can be a sign of excess fat/protien. I keep my dogs on 30/20 year around but reduce the amount by about 1/3 in the summer....I run harder in the summer most years than I do in winter......Sometimes 3 or 4 all night runs a week(8-10 hours)in approx 75 deg weather depending on work schedule....to this date Ive never had problems with dogs overheating or exhaustion. If you dont believe, get in touch, Im always looking for someone as crazy as I am to wander in the woods all night listening to a pack of hounds. I do have guys I run with change over to the maintanance foods and after 3-4 hours their dogs return to truck, drink water till they puke, and want back in the box. Some of this is obviously conditioning, but I think maintanance food has a role as well. Oh course they will tell you they have been feeding this way for years and that their dogs are just in poor running shape, I dont argue! Until I have a bad experience with 30/20 "good stuff", Ill be sticking with it year around.....This is a tough subject to get exact answers on because of all the variables, I recommend sticking with what works, and the best 30/20 blend I can get my hands on will be feeding my dogs! I also add raw eggs or bacon greese to the food on occation and I can tell they appreciate it!!!!

swamper · Post by **swamper** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:03 pm

I also feed 26/18 year around and it gets real hot down here in sa. ga./
all i do is cut back on the amount of feed .i do get a hot spot on a dogs coat ever now and then but i belive this has to do with the dog not the feed other wise all of my dogs would get the hot spots.

Bunny Runner · Post by **Bunny Runner** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:33 pm

Well said, Mybeagles!

I could add to what you have posted by saying:
Fat contains 9 kcals per gram and protein contains 4 kcals per gram. Fat is the main energy source, while protein is use for maintaining and building muscle as well as other metabolic functions. Excess protein in the diet is eliminated by the kidneys, but DOES NOT cause kidney disease or failure. Protein is not stored as fat if not used by the body. Carbohydrates (4 kcals/gram), on the other hand, do provide some energy, but any excess is stored as fat in the body. An overweight dog can overheat easier than a dog in optimal body condition. Carbs are also harder for dogs to digest if they have not been processed properly. Dogs dietary requirement for carbs is not fully understood, but it is believed that if they need carbs, their requirements would be relatively low and should come from fruits, veggies, and whole grains.
Meat-based proteins are better digested, expending less energy and less waste. Good quality proteins can be consumed in a very high quantity, for instance, I feed (at times) a food that is 42% protein http://www.naturapet.com/display.php?d= ... 1246%27%5D and they perform well, have great stamina, and rebound ALOT quicker. I use this in my rotation of foods.
Lesser quality proteins, from grains, when used as a primary protein source or from generic "meat and bone meal" or "meat meal" are most likely going to cause problems when you start adding enough of them to create a high protein food.
For instance, meat and bone meal is VERY HIGH in minerals which can cause kidney problems such as cacium oxylate crystals (kidney stones). The use of enough meat and bone meal to manufacture a high protein food, could in fact, cause kidney problems in your dog. Then add a bunch of grain fragments like wheat gluten meal, corn gluten meal, wheat midlins, etc in addition to the MBM and your dog can have problems with their skin/coat, kidneys, GIT, less than optimal body condition, diabetes, heart problems, etc.

Mybeagles, you would probably appreciate this food http://www.eaglepack.com/pages/ep_power.html

mybeagles · Post by **mybeagles** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:02 am

Bunny, I have some mushers that live about an hour from my house that sell a high protein (42%) with high fat, I think (24%). No corn or soy. Im strongly considering rotating some of that in Dec/Jan time frame when temps get bitter cold.....This formula was developed by a Vet thats an active musher, and a PhD in dog nutrition from Michigan State University...I spoke with Vet who is from the Upper Peninsula of Mich, and he felt it would be worth trying if you were going to run real hard in the winter (25+ hours wk.) but probly unecessary the rest of the year....I dont normally run more than that in the winter due to ice cutting up dogs feet.....I have looked at the feed link you mentioned, but not any local distributors....do you feed this type, and are you satisfied with it?

Bunny Runner · Post by **Bunny Runner** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:17 am

Both the links I provided, I have and do feed my dogs. The EVO is one I don't use as often (about every 2 -3 months I will mix it in with their regular feed), but the Eagle Pack is a regular part of my feeding program.
I use for my dogs that are running alot. The dogs love it and it's made such a difference in their condition. Their coats are great, performance is awesome, endurance and rebound are the best I've seen yet. It also has cut down on the dog and kennel odor. My dogs no longer have that "hound" smell.

I would highly recommed either of the foods linked, but for general feeding, I like the Eagle Pack formulas.