How Important is close check work?

Hood Swamp · Post by **Hood Swamp** » Sun May 29, 2011 1:05 pm

All the dogs I've ever seen that swing, were consistantly ran with dogs that were faster than they were, and they could'nt take not being on the front.

deerhost · Post by **deerhost** » Sun May 29, 2011 1:18 pm

Well put.....Lee!!!

bucks better beagles · Sun May 29, 2011 3:18 pm

Hood Swamp: Good observation but the implication and logic of your post is that those who DO NOT swing are content to run behind. I don't feel a dog should ever be content running behind but should always try to get to the front. Me tooers are a dime a dozen, as, some of you would say, so are swingers.

Hood Swamp · Post by **Hood Swamp** » Sun May 29, 2011 4:48 pm

Bucks Better Beagles, Content running behind...maybe? More concerned with running the rabbit than who is leading the pack....Absolutely! I would personally rather see a dog go to the front by just going to the front straight through the pack. Of course thats hard to do in briars....and this is when I have seen the majority of dogs swing. Example: Your running in a big briar bed and have a check. Lu Lu picks up the check followed by the pack, but hey, I dont hear Numnuts

Oh wait, there he is, how in the world did he get fifty feet in front of the pack. Well all the smart dogs in the pack know how he got there and it want be long before they all know how to get such a sweet lead on every one else.

My point is, a dog that is fast enough to handle his packmates will get to the front by running the rabbit through the pack or shouldering, but staying with the pack. In all the dogs I have seen the one that swings naturally, does so because they are too slow for the pack. Nothing wrong with a dog wanting to run up at the front, but please dont swing around to do it.

And yes, me tooers are a dime a dozen.

a-dog · Post by **a-dog** » Sun May 29, 2011 5:25 pm

hood swamp is right .hate when a dog does what he describes hate it even more when running with a dog like that and the owner says thinks his dog is fast.most will eventually end up running the outside all the time all they do is turn the rabbit and teach other dogs bad habits.if you want the front get it though the pack and hang on to it once you got it.plus don't keep barking when you over run it

rabbithunter5890 · Post by **rabbithunter5890** » Mon May 30, 2011 8:33 am

I have found that a lot of people think they have fast dogs just because they do anything to get to the front, even if it hurts the race. I have saw some dogs that swing that are fast and those dogs can get down, but most of they time its not the case.

mtnwaykennel · Post by **mtnwaykennel** » Mon May 30, 2011 9:34 am

I must put mine in here as well.

There are many dogs out there that have won in any format that they have been entered in. Because they know how to find the scent in a check. Sometimes it is close.. sometimes it is out there a little but they can find it. When I judge a LP trial I would not own half the dogs I see because they are to wild. They seldom run the rabbit. They run spots of scent and each other. I can not stand a dog that blows a race up. I have sold many a hound that people love because they are swingers and wild. I don't like that but that is my taste. As for check work.. if they have blown the track up to the point that the check can not be picked up close.. they have no place to be running a rabbit out there if they blow it up 20 or 30 yards. 20 feet.. that is ok and reasonable in my book because it happens.. but I have a line there I draw in the sand.

Bill Woods

Alabama John · Post by **Alabama John** » Mon May 30, 2011 9:44 am

Hood,

what you described the dog doing to get the front in briars is called CUTTING down here and its different than swinging.

We also see cutters running on the outside of the pack to one side or the other hoping the rabbit turns their direction, or even worse running to get ahead of the pack and jumping around quick like a shortstop after a ball looking to catch the rabbit. You are right, they usually do these things silent.

You can see all this and more being done at one place. Go to a Big Pack Trial where they turn loose 100 dogs at a time.

hurryup · Post by **hurryup** » Mon May 30, 2011 12:00 pm

Hood Swamp wrote:All the dogs I've ever seen that swing, were consistantly ran with dogs that were faster than they were, and they could'nt take not being on the front.

Sorry I disagree with your post. Some bloodlines run a little looser line and will swing a little more because thats the way they are bred. Same as some will work tight tight line and checks. Kinda like some dogs have more mouth or are tighter. I agree what and how you run them makes a diffrence but there is more involved.

Roseland · Post by **Roseland** » Mon May 30, 2011 12:55 pm

hookset · Post by **hookset** » Mon May 30, 2011 12:59 pm

Alabama John wrote:what you described the dog doing to get the front in briars is called CUTTING down here and its different than swinging.

That's what I've been trying to point out...Cutting and Skirting is different than Swinging in the check. Most people on here are claiming that if a dog is not close in the check area, then they cut and skirt. Big difference. They way people talk here, if your dog swings, then it automatically skirts and cuts to get the front. So by using that logic, I guess if a dog is close in the check, it's automatically a mouthy backtracker. If the logic used here goes one way, it has to go the other...

bucks better beagles · Mon May 30, 2011 2:30 pm

I think there is a lot of confusion on here to the use of the various terms. The thread title is "How Important is close check work?" This has opened up the door for swingers and cutters. I made my responses and am misunderstood. Any dog that through its actions messes up a race is not a Good Dog. I believe "Speed Kills" and will stick to it but, a fast dog must be able to move a rabbit. Now, how it moves that rabbit is open to subject discussion. If you have a close check dog vs a fast checker that constantly keeps the rabbit on the run, that is the one I want. I want a good race and a fast one. In the country I live in, if you can keep up with a dog with a camera, it is moving too slow. The only time we see the dogs is on road crossings. The dog barreling across the road first is the one I want if it is consistent and pushing the rab.

hookset · Post by **hookset** » Mon May 30, 2011 3:53 pm

If this thread continues, let's keep it to the topic of 'close check work'. Not comparing the worst swinging dog you've seen to the best close-check dog you've seen.

You can't compare the BEST player in the National League to the WORST player in the American League and come the the conclusion that the National League must be way better.

Hood Swamp · Post by **Hood Swamp** » Mon May 30, 2011 7:06 pm

Well, if I were to stay on point, and answer the question "How important is close check work"? I would first have to decide whether I like my pack to run together or spread out a little. Also, whether I ran a pack or just had one dog? If I didn't care whether my pack ran close together, I would'nt think close check work was as important. The main thing I would be concerned about was how goooooooood the dog was.

I just got a male that has made a couple of winners packs and has a little bigger check area than I am use to. He has yet to dominate or beat my little females that have never been in a trial. Many times, while he is reaching that extra 10-20 feet, they are picking up the check close by and moving out.

It really boils down to how the owner likes his dogs to work a check and run a rabbit

deerhost · Post by **deerhost** » Mon May 30, 2011 8:31 pm

Yea, Speed is good but when the dog can handle the speed and can hold the line. You can't make a statement like the first dog crossing the path is the dog to own If your not talking about everything else he's doing. And yes he has too be able to push the rabbit, But the trick is to push the rabbit without creating checks.

Again my opinion is:

***Good speed, Clean and close on the check and on the line and big nose= Long runs with fewer checks and lost rabbits.
***B#LLS to the wall every second of the race, running hit and miss to stay in front, wide check area and reaching too
far=A break down every 100 yards and long checks.

Is close check work important? Yes!!! The closer the check work the faster the dog finds the line again the smoother the run. The wider the check and the more reaching, the wider the area the dog has to cover to pick up the line again. Example Rabbit makes a left turn at point A. The dog that reaches or works a wide check comes to point A. but goe's over it and reaches out front, he is gambling, after checking 10-20 or 30 yards ahead he realizes the check is behind him or loose the rabbit all together. A dog working a closer check may come to point A. were the rabbit turns and start looking for track at the loss and bingo it's right there with in a few yards of were the rabbit turned. Now granted the dog that reaches out will get lucky at times but the odds of a smoother race with shorter or less frequent breakdowns are with the dog working a closer check area. I have had both kinds of dogs and I will choose a closer working dog any day...But I still like good speed, I'm Just not all hung up over the speed thing like some people are.....................DH

The American Beagler Forum

How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?

Re: How Important is close check work?