Too Young to Run??

[houndboy13]

are you guys starting these young pups in a pen before taking them in the wild with the older hounds or are they just put in the wild when they are old enough to keep up and see if they catch on and let nature take its course? like hearing alll the different ways guys raise young dogs.

[APFII]

I see no need to burn up good prospects just to get that one that will handle the pressure at that young age . Plus I see to many hounds that burn out at an early age. To each is own, just saying.

PS Buck, believe it or not I do know the difference between a dog and a kid.

[bucks better beagles]

Houndboy13: No pens, no textbooks, no excuses. Just breed them right and turn them loose. Got 3 hours out of these pups today and that makes 5 days in a row. They sleep well at night.

APF: Knew that all the time. I would put a smiley face here but I don't know how. I can train a pup but don't know diddle about these machines.

[bucks better beagles]

Thanks to all who have PM'd. These pups are not for sale today. Try again in about a month. They will be 5 months old then and should look much better.

Buck

[houndboy13]

Buck your way sounds alot like how my dad use to run his pups when i was a kid..he didnt have a pen to take pups to anyway so he would just cut the whole litter loose in the bush with a few older hounds..seems like every man will have there own idea on what works best and thats what makes running them so fun ..would be nice to see a litter split down the middle and started both ways ( pen started, and thrown in the wild) to see which method might have the better percentage of pups turn out..if guys on here have used both methods maybe they can chime in and say what they thought or think..i'm always looking to better what i feed and think topics like this are very informative

[pineridgebeagles]

The cream always comes to the top,but not always at the same speed.I start my pups in the wild with and without a pack some pups pack right up and start right away and some need a little more time.My 2 best dogs I ever owned were worthless until 9-10 months old and then it clicked.Ive learned a little something in over 45 yrs of owning and starting pups,notice i didnt say training,you cant train for hunt and running style.Patience. Al

[Bunnyblaster]

Buck I have heard both sides to this argument many times and between that and what I've seen my take on it is simple.

1. I think some dogs it will never make a difference because they were never going to be a "me-tooer" to begin with.

2. I think there are dogs that if given enough time to build their confidence they will not become a "me-tooer" but if pressured too much at a young age then they could sway that way.

3. And I also think there are dogs that are going to "me-too" no matter what you do with them short of soloing them for their entire lives so there is never another dog around for them to "me-too" with.


Now for the beaglers it's all in what you want and are willing to do and/or tolerate. In your case if you do not want a dog that would ever do that then your culling process is probably just right for you. I do think that you run the risk and have possibly had a dog or so over the years that would fall under # 2 and could've been good or even great but maybe became a "me-tooer" because of how you choose to train your young dogs mostly in the pack. I don't think that makes your way wrong but if given the same opportunity with a different beagler that will spend time soloing a dog then that particular hound would maybe have never developed the habit.

This is maybe not the best analogy but I relate it to my kids and school. Some kids are smart and independent and learn quickly on their own or in a group. Others can and will learn it if given the opportunity but may need some one on one help to get there. If no special time is given they tend to fall behind, get frustrated and just go along for the ride but never really add much to the group except on occasion. And others will never get it no matter how hard you try for one reason or another.


I fall under the "give em a little time" group and that's my decision to make. I would never tell someone else how to handle theirs because they know what they're looking for and I don't. I don't think you're raising a bunch of "me-tooers". I think you may have helped a few possibly become that way but most if given the time early enough after you let them go would probably come out of it. The few that don't I wouldn't want to own in the first place so I doubt you made them any worse than they were destined to be. And I don't know a quicker way to weed out the "me-tooers" than to do what you're doing. It's easy to see independence if you just get in there and watch.

[bucks better beagles]

Weed and cull Bunny, weed and cull. I am an old man. I don't have time or inclination to give a dog time to improve or " come into his own". I don't keep or want around me, "just average" dogs. I want the upper 2% and am willing to do whatever it takes to get them. That means getting rid of the bottom 98%. These pups I have now may never be what I want and I will know that real soon. My way isn't for everybody or, for that matter, probably most beaglers but, it is my way and has worked pretty good over the years.

Update, one of them showed timidity when it came time for me to catch him last night. Sold him this morning.

I hope nobody takes my philosophy wrong. I am not mean to my dogs. Just the opposite. I give them everything they need but, in return, I demand certain qualities that they all don't possess and will never possess.

[Newt]

Houndboy13: No pens, no textbooks, no excuses. Just breed them right and turn them loose. Got 3 hours out of these pups today and that makes 5 days in a row. They sleep well at night.

APF: Knew that all the time. I would put a smiley face here but I don't know how. I can train a pup but don't know diddle about these machines.

I agree. I start all of mine as soon as they will smell a track. I've got a thirteen week old pup that tries to run with the older dogs. I took her across the road with the older dogs and she tried to follow them. She can't stay up but I did hear hep open a few times. I also have an almost six month old pup whose owner kept him in a pen all his life. I took him along also. He acted as if he was scared to be out. He staid in my shadow all the time.

[Bunnyblaster]

That's exactly what I meant buck, it works for you and that's all that matters. Now me, I am much, much, much younger and have a few more years to learn so I take em and try........for now anyway. I am guessing the older I get the quicker I will be to make the cut as I'm guessing experience will begin to tell me that once that way then generally they may not tend to change.

I strive to achieve mediocrity in my life and so far it has served me well so I figure why change now?!? In all seriousness at this point in my life I choose to just enjoy the dogs and the time out in the woods with friends and my kids. I would rather have an average dog that wants to be my buddy than a super star that could care less if he ever got petted by my kids. Like I said as I get older this may change and it may not but same as you it's my way and it works for me. And like I said I would never fault anyone for doing what works best for themselves...........within reason anyway.

[littlewoody]

Come on Littlewoody, their bloodline don't mater. At least that is what a lot of people say. I want to judge them on what they do and then we will look at their pedigree. Their book is still to be written but the first chapter is done. Oh by the way, their names are:

Ghost Train Kane
Ghost Train Jane (male)
Ghost Train Pane
Ghost Train Trane

Fair enough Buck how About some pictures of these fox hounds aka beagles.

[johns03272008]

Don't forget to spay and neuter the ones you keep so they can't pass on their great genes!

[bucks better beagles]

Johns, funny you should say that. I don't neuter the males, but I do spay all the females I keep. I look at it this way, if they come in heat, my males are messed up for at least a month. The females can't go with the males so they miss a lot of hunting. Further, there are plenty guys out there that like females and like to raise puppies so, when I need one, I can get one from them. Just a matter of digits.

[bucks better beagles]

Woody, I have some pictures, send my your home e-mail and I will send you a couple.