The American Beagler Forum

Posted: **Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:34 pm**

Crow wrote:
Sundown Beagles wrote:We often give a shot of Oxytocin (believe thats the spelling) within hours after pups are born. This seems to work very well for us.
Out of curiosity why do you give that? Oxytocin (pitocin) is used to induce uterine contraction. This is done prior to birth to induce or expedite birth & is also used to treat post delivery hemorrhage. Not being a butt, I'm just curious, my female just had and lost a litter of 4 a few weeks ago.

Oxytocin induces uterine contractions(post labor shot will assist in getting out any retained placentas, etc.) and assists in milk letdown. I also give the shot post labor and sometimes during labor if it's been a long process and high pup count to help the female out because her natural levels of oxytocin are going to be getting used up.

Posted: **Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:49 pm**

You could probably save your money on the oxytocin. I give them a pill form of potassium...over the counter. And or straight Greek yogurt....liquified. High potassium will have Same effects as oxytocin.....less expensive and more easily regulated.

I would say nature has a way of telling you which ones get a chance....harsh....but that is the way it works in the wild as well.

Posted: **Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:56 pm**

beaglestotrack wrote:i have raised a bunch of litters sounds like coccidosis too me...

This is bad stuff ! a real pup killer!

Posted: **Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:56 pm**

Coccidia is out of the question here because they were only a few days old. To get coccidia the pups would have to be 13 to 14 days old. Like I said in my first post I had to go out of town on family issuers and my hunting bud took care of my dogs. I was home the day they were born and my pens are under oak trees with all day shade. It was worm but not too bad. I have raised 100's of pups from hounds to beagles even dash hounds and never seen nothing like this.

Slaux asked was it any illness that I seen. For the last few weeks the f.m. has been digging into her water cooling things off I guess. The pen has been wet and at first I thought her water bowl was leaking and replaced it with a 2 gal bucket and later found her digging in the bucket. Before I put the f.m. into the brooder pen two weeks ago I Clorox it out three days in a row before I put her into it. I just had a litter back in April in the same pen and have washed it several times before this.

Posted: **Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:24 am**

Did ya give any wormer, shots or medication while the bitch was in whelp?
Sounds like all kennel conditions were spick-an-span.
This kinda leaves us with the bitch and her mothering instincts, or the puppies and wallop within them to live.
I seen weedy looking puppies that didn't seem have much of a chance make it and thrive, and others that looked fine and healthy die.

Posted: **Wed Aug 13, 2014 3:21 am**

Mr. SR The mother is a first time bitch to having pups. The first day she was taking good care of the pups. The man who was feeding and taking care of my dogs has had beagles for years also. He told me the 2nd day she was taking care of the pups and it looked like she just laid on the first two that died. He said she did not like him taking her dead pups away.

I did not give ant worm meds when she was breed. I did nothing different this time then I have always have. Yesterday her tits looked funny. The front two were big but the back was hard I really think it’s something to do with the milk.

Posted: **Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:12 am**

Our vet recommended the Oxytocin for the same reasons others have listed. We have experienced very few issues since adopting this process.

Posted: **Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:31 am**

The real problem is, the mother showed no signs or effect of placenta retention or mastitis. A placenta retained 24 hrs will have the bitch feeling awful bad and not caring for pups. The mastitis being a bacterial infection would have the teat inflamed, feverish and a lump/cake could be felt as your seeing now.
I think I would have went to the vet on the 4th or fifth day, somewhere between loosing the 3rd to 6th pup. Now a week later we're sitting here talking about your bitch with

Yesterday her tits looked funny. The front two were big but the back was hard I really think it’s something to do with the milk.

The biggest threat of mastitis was always milk being produced and not utilized, as when loosing a litter or at weaning.
This may be some help as to where your at now.

Treating Canine Mastitis
Treatment depends on the severity of the condition and may include antibiotics, hot packing the affected glands, and milking out the affected glands. Puppies can continue to nurse from the affected gland if the milk remains normal. If your brood bitch shows signs of breast infection it may be canine mastitis, so get her to your vet immediately. He will prescribe some antibiotics that distribute to the milk. Mastitic milk is usually acidic, and bases distribute better into acidic milk. Ampicillin or oxacillin are good choices until a culture and sensitivity results are back You may want to keep the pups nursing the bitch if possible, because this will keep the glands drained.

Invariably the infection will cause the breast will rupture out the side, leaving a large open wound which must be cleaned daily. The antibiotics will prevent further reinfection. If there is an open abscess or gangrene, then remove pups and hand feed. Treat the abscessed gland as open wound. You'll find that when she has litters of puppies in future, she may not produce milk in the breast segment that was affected by canine mastitis.

Chronic mastitis in the bitch can occur, even if the only symptom exhibited is that the puppies are not thriving. The incidence of this condition in the dog is currently unknown. Regardless, bitches diagnosed with chronic mastitis require aggressive antibiotic therapy. Unlike acute mastitis, chronic cases may require the use of special medicines that will cross the barrier between the blood and milk.

Galactostasis
This condition occurs when milk is not removed from the mammary gland promptly. With galactostasis you see hard, caked glands because the bitch is not producing milk. Galactostasis normally occurs in bitches with small litters or when pups utilize only one or two teats. The condition can also occur as a result of a false pregnancy. As long as there is no inflammation and infection, galactostasis is not usually serious. However, a bitch with this condition is often very uncomfortable. The breeder/owner can provide symptomatic relief by soaking the glands by applying cool towel compresses. The veterinarian may prescribe diuretics or pain alleviating drugs. Reduction in food can lead to lowered milk production and aid the bitch with galactostasis. Milking the affected glands may actually lead to increased milk production. depends on the severity of the condition and may include antibiotics, hot packing the affected glands, and milking out the affected glands. Puppies can continue to nurse from the affected gland if the milk remains normal. If your brood bitch shows signs of breast infection it may be canine mastitis, so get her to your vet immediately. He will prescribe some antibiotics that distribute to the milk. Mastitic milk is usually acidic, and bases distribute better into acidic milk. Ampicillin or oxacillin are good choices until a culture and sensitivity results are back You may want to keep the pups nursing the bitch if possible, because this will keep the glands drained.

Good luck taking care of your bitch.

Posted: **Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:35 pm**

Not one to argue by any mean just wanted to mention this....... I had a bitch many years ago that I obtained from someone for breeding. She had a litter of six I believe and at about 3 days old they became ill and started dropping like flies. The bitch developed horrible diarrhea as did the pups, yellow, nasty, stinky stuff. Pups had the "the death wine" and died quickly. I was just a kid at the time, & brought bitch and pups to vet. Put her and pups on Sulpha and I don't recall what else. Saved the bitch and two of the pups, who I had to bottle feed as her milk was bad. Only reason I post this, is from experience I know they can get Coccidia at a few days old, as I experienced it, and it was nasty. From what your describing, it was not Coccidia, you'd have known it.

One thing, which I've never experienced though, is maybe the bitch was wormy and so were the pups. Sometimes bitches can be full of round or tape and never show any signs until you worm them. I've heard of pups dying at a few days old due to being full of worms, though I've never seen it first hand, nor ever read anything concrete on that. I always worm my bitches prior to and after breeding them and have never had an issue. In fact, when I keep my bitches up on wire and make sure they are clean of worms, my pups are completely clean of worms from day one. (The claim that pups "always" have round worm from mothers milk is not true - I debunked that one on accident.) Keep dogs on the ground or not worm them after running while bred and you'll have round worm though, guaranteed. Sounds like you did just about everything right and she was mothering them. Maybe she was stressed with you not being there. Maybe her milk never came in right. Could have been a combination of things. You may never know... Good luck in the future.

Posted: **Thu Aug 14, 2014 9:23 am**

There are worm eggs encysted within the bitch that just lay in wait of the hormone of whelping to be released and filter through the linings to mother and milk of the pups, your worming won't get these until they've been released to develop, so mother and pups should always be suspect of worms even if kept off ground and pre-wormed.

Milk-aid from happy jack, I always thought was a good investment of first time mothers, aid in milk production and preventing acid milk .jmho

Posted: **Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:14 am**

You could probably save your money on the oxytocin. I give them a pill form of potassium...over the counter. And or straight Greek yogurt....liquified. High potassium will have Same effects as oxytocin.....less expensive and more easily regulated.

I would say nature has a way of telling you which ones get a chance....harsh....but that is the way it works in the wild as well.

I would use caution when giving high levels of potassium. Oxytocin is a hormone and targets a specific receptor, while potassium is an electrolyte and is used by the body (dog and human) for many different process. Hyperkalemia can cause irregular heart rhythms which can be fatal and even more so if the heart is stressed ( dog in labor). The reason you have similar results with it, is that it changes the nerve impulses that are sent to the placenta and causes a greater reaction while also causing a great imbalance. Oxytocin is given to bind to more receptor sites to cause the contraction and is deactivated if you will once it is used. So the short of it oxytocin is specific to the uterine contractions during labor and potassium effects all of the bodies system.

Posted: **Thu Aug 14, 2014 11:19 am**

Not giving high levels....just a supplement. I agree with what you said.

Posted: **Fri Aug 15, 2014 11:42 pm**

Ok let me start off with saying thanks to all the help trying to finger this out. I had my vet tech friend to run by my house this week and check her out. She said it did not look like mastitis but she put her on antibiotics anyway. She said it could have been the heat.

She also backed up what I said earlier about coccidian. They cannot get it at a week old that it takes two weeks after birth.

I always breed on days that calculate up for me to be off work. I did it this time also but did not expect on having to leave and go out of town.

This is one I will mark up as a lost and move on. Thanks for all the concerns and help. If it’s one think we as rabbit hunters have learned, all days can’t be good and sometimes we should have just stayed at home.

Thanks,
David

Posted: **Sat Aug 16, 2014 7:50 am**

I have raised alot of litters of Pups and I use Python Tags for over 5 Years and never had any problems with the Tags and the females.

Posted: **Sun Aug 17, 2014 12:33 pm**

MILK ADE NEVER RAISE A LITTER WITHOUT IT

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