when do you call it "your line"

S.R.Patch · Post by **S.R.Patch** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:01 pm

Ahhh, whats the matter Doc, business been slow.
Well pull up your nittin' and have a seat, you know when us boys gets together, we're either complainin' about them hens or actin' like'um...lol
Didn't realize you was such a worldly traveled man. Kinda like a fella try'in to build his line of hounds but just aint found what suites him yet, but once he does, he settles in an starts to build on it.
I think you struck on something though, it's usually others that bestowe the title of having ones own line upon the owner, usually because he has become so set and hard headed in his ways. He knows every hound he's bred(and there've been many), he knows a few others who breed their hounds well and where to get a bit of a cross if needed. His mold has been cast and the results from it are pleasing to his eye(oh, there is always room for improvment but the house is built on a firm foundation).
Why do we want everything quick and easy, do we lack patients, are we easily bored. I've always found the tempering of the metal, the crafting of the mold, as much a part of the reward as beholding the finished product. In this fast paced world we live, the rush to get there, has caused us to overlook the enjoyment of the ride, for therein lies the true art of breeding hounds.
Thanks for chipin' in Doc. and let us know when them hares turn white...

All the best...Patch

Doc S · Post by **Doc S** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 3:55 pm

They're about 1/3 to 1/2 white now Patch! Looked at a handful of them this morning...

They are kinda fun critters to run actually...run'em in the heavy cover and they will alternate between ziggin' and zaggin' like a rabbit and lining out and running BIG!!!

The debates on hare hounds versus rabbit hounds were also kinda interesting. Everything I have was started, trained, and raised on cottontails and swampers, but shifting gears to hare was no big deal(well, other than me trying to figure where to cast them anyway!). Nice place to be up here...I have spots I can run hare, spots I can run cottontails, and spots I will hit both. I gun very little myself, but took a buddy two weeks ago that likes to shoot and he shot equal numbers of both in front of some young hounds of mine.

No need to worry 'bout business being slow here either. Just saved all my vacation for rabbit and partridge season...

I'm no dumbie! LOL! Time up here to go back to the grind though and let them "Yeah-Hoo's" clear out the deer numbers now.

Guess now I have run and gunned in nine different states for 29 years now this season with extreme southern Louisiana being the most southern and the south shore of Lake Superior being the most northern, so if that makes me "worldly and travelled" then I am. One thing is for sure...travel that much, look at that many different hounds(from different "lines"), and look at that much different cover it sure enough makes it hard to be satisfied with a dog. I keep 12 hounds now. Anything out there over 2 years old I would not be a bit ashamed to cast with anything anyone has, but I can tell you the holes in every one of them!

As for patience and wanting things quick...that is our society today. We want dinner from a fast food window in 60 seconds or less or we get agitated. We want e-file and direct deposit to spead up our tax returns. And we want hounds to circle their own rabbit at 4 months old! We live in an instant society today...unfortunately. Just the way things are...

As to building a bloodline... My son is now 5 years old(and eat up with running dogs too I might add), and if he is still running dogs at my age I would hope they would be recognized as a line I had started. Time will tell as that is 30+ years from now!

Best run now,
Doc S

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:29 pm

Blackdirt, do you have anything in your kennel that is as good as Grizzly bear right now?

blackdirt beagles · Post by **blackdirt beagles** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 7:20 pm

who wants to know

anyway - my male dog tom is just as good at his age now as bear was at the same age in my opinion. only time will tell how he fully finishes out, but i am very happy to have him. i sold a littermate of tom to a friend in NJ and according to him, he is one TOUGH dog. i will see him run this december as i sold him as a just started dog. grizzly bear was the grandfather to these 2. also had a nice female out of him that was a real brag dog. she made her way to WI as old age got her. my friend in NJ also has a female out of bear who got 8th in the Penn. LP (i think... or maybe PP...cant remember) state hunt this last year. 2 other females i can think of ended up going to gunhunters that i dont think any money could buy. another decent female(out of bear) just coming off pups now i can think of. bryan pucka of IN ended up with nice female out of bear about 3? years ago. these are just off the top of my head. lots of very nice dogs and a few exra nice ones. hope that helps you out "guest". maybe if you send me an email i will go thru my files and give you some names.

warddog · Post by **warddog** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 7:54 pm

I have to agree with Doc S. You can call it Ray or you can call it Jay but when others call it by your name then that's when it's your line. You can make cross after cross but if you don't set desirable traits so that others recognize the fruits of your labor then evidently you haven't started a line. A line is a strain or a group of individuals presumably from a common ancestry with set clear cut distinctions as to character, quality and disposition. These distinctions would then be inherent in the offspring. Bearing in mind that no line is perfect and if a specific lineage is crossed and the offspring show no distinctive characteristics or qualities then that is nothing more than a cross of that line. Now if you cross specific lineages and get desirable characteristics and then make crosses within that family where the desirable traits are inherent then I would say you have yourself something that catches the eye of others and they will sing your praises. Without your peers acknowledging your endevors you have nothing more than a cross. I've made a bunch of crosses that produced a dog that suited me but I've never made a cross that produced a bunch of dogs that suited a majority of the people that got them.

blackdirt beagles · Post by **blackdirt beagles** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 10:32 pm

i appreciate all the posts guys. but i think im gonna end it here as a couple guys made this all about my dogs which isnt what i had in mind. my question was a very general one that could of been about anyones dogs. in answer to my own post, i do think that i have established my own line. its at the very first level, but i have a foundation, i have traits i am breeding for and after a few generations i am gettin good results. so that to me is a good start. thanks for the serious replies

. too bad we got offtrack.

S.R.Patch · Post by **S.R.Patch** » Thu Nov 11, 2004 12:04 am

Hey Doc,
Sounds like your doin' great, very happy for ya!
We did a hare hunt in the UP about 3 weeks ago, the legs and ears were all that had changed, lots of young hare, don't stand in the field, got to get in the edge of timber, cross the 2-tracks where the closest timber meets the road, I'm a good road hunter...lol
Had a real good weed field but those hare would not cross in those weeds, they always stayed in the woods or at least a tree line, cottontail would have loved that field of weeds.
Lots of young hare, some ran like cottontail, maybe 20 acre circles but there would at times be 2 or 3 running the same path, then split and take some hounds this way and some that. We hunted the same area through the week and it was better as the numbers declined but with each day that passed so did my dog power, didn't have the hounds in shape for day after day hunting on the rock, their feet and shoulders suffered badly. I felt like such a fool for not having foot dressing with me. Luckly a friend came to run with us one day(would have been more if he'd remembered his supply bag..lol) and brought in some fresh dog power(thanks Hare).
Man, those grouse are fast, no shots but we saw a lot, they were either over your head or to far out in the field when they got up. Would have liked to have tried a couple for supper one night.
I think I could live up there, then my ole buddy tells those stories about breaking through on his snowshoes up to his arm pits and having to wallow his way out, and then I think, "man, are you nuts"...lol
I don't mind the cold & snow but it seems there is always wind off the lakes and that tears me up.
If there's a warm spell after Thanksgiving give me a hollar, I want a white one

...Patch

laal · Post by **laal** » Thu Nov 11, 2004 10:54 am

I think a line of dogs start with a male and fe-male from two different lines (not related) you keep breeding from these two dogs untill you put your name on them (at least 4 generations). It takes time, lots of running, some luck, but if after all this who can say that these dogs are not your line?

p.s. I'm out of here, I got some fish creek, blackcreek, shorts, stubby, wier creek, and back yard dogs that need running. (5 dogs) nothing special but good rabbit dogs, if thay were great I would be breeding them and making my line.