Run to catch

[Beagle Huntsman]

Interesting post, Dana. In other parts of the country, the UGBF hounds are running much faster. The UGBF needs to decide what they are going to promote. Sounds like in your area, they are still running 90s style hounds. I hated those, but I think I would like what they run in Indiana or Kentucky today.

That said, I never let my hounds get more than 50 yards from me. With 15-20 hounds out, I want them close where I can direct and watch them.

[Shady Grove Beagles]

Hey Tim
Been a while. Hope all is well with you and the beagles.
I've heard that U.B.G.F. in some areas are now running a much stouter hound than they used to. When I moved to Tn. in '95 and through 2010 I ran on a W.M.A. in middle Tn. where a U.B.G.F. club ran and held their trials. I saw their hounds run a fair amount, observed series at several of their trials and was even asked to judge at one of their club "fun trials".
I found their hounds very conservative, speed a tad below medium and their search / hunt poor. Most of the rabbits run were tally ho'd by the handlers and gallery.
Here it is 25 years later and the U.B.G.F. beagles I saw last Saturday to my eyes were the same style of hound. I'll give them credit as when they get on the rabbit they lock on and can pretty much keep him going and they never stop barking [?]. They are very accurate on the line but even they have some checks.
I think their judges are so anxious to get them on a line so they can score that they ignore hunting / jumping pushing the dogs right through the cover and the series I watched they sure didn't let them run very long before picking them up and going to next series. Every thing is about accuracy and control. I like some fire.
I've never been to a A.R.H.A. Progressive Pack trial. Hear that their hounds still have good foot but they require them to be pretty clean on line and in checks.
I think the further south you go the more conservative the clubs are and the judges and thus the hounds.. Most of the entries were Tennessee, Alabama and Georgia.
As far as a hounds hunting range. I can definitely understand your need to keep a pack of your size under control. I've watched the formal beagle packs operate up at the National Beagle Club at Aldie,Va. and the way they handle is really something to see.
I really have never tried to control the way my hounds hunt / search. I feel that hounds have a natural inclination as to how they operate and basically I let them have their head.
When I coon hunted there were guys that had what I called "go yonder" dogs. The ones that when they cleared the tailgate you never saw them again until they treed. Never cared for that type.
My beagles cover a lot of ground but they know where I am and do check in as they hunt.

[Beagle Huntsman]

I read about foxhounds being “Balboa” hounds. When you turned them out, they headed west to find a fox or the Pacific Ocean - whichever came first. I am sure your hounds are not like those, Dana.

[warddog]

Dana, that type of coon hound is one part of it that made me quit doing it. I had a BIg blue tic that I had a lot of money in that would get out of the country. My hunting partner and I bought him together and the night we hunted him when we bought him in Michigan he got treed pretty quickly the entire evening. The first night we hunted him in our state he sent him onto a very little woods in the middle of a field and got treed. We were pleased but the second drop he got gone and we never heard a thing out of him. After about 45 minutes we drove around listening and finally could barely hear a dog barking off in the distances so we drove to it and sure enough he was in another small patch of woods in the middle of a field a mile and a half from where we turned him loose. Had a coon. The next time out he did the same thing and my hunting partner wanted no part of him any more. I bought his part out because I felt guilty as I was the one who found the dog and bragged it up as a coon dog. Hunted him many times when the coon were not moving and I did not come home with him. Had to go pick him up the next day at someone's house. I used to say that when I turned him loose I lifted up his tail and kissed his back side good bye. He treed coon that most would never find but in doing so he actually took the enjoyment out of it for me. I did sell the dog bu8t the damage had already been done. His leaving the country and getting onto property I had no idea of who owned were BIG downers even though he treed coon. That leaving the country stayed with me as far as running beagles as well. I like them to hunt with me rather than me hunt with them. Even one that hunts out like a bird dog gets me wondering where it's gonna end up and the cover it has missed.

[Beagle Huntsman]

Warddog, that type of coonhound would soon get you into trouble these days. In the 1970s, you could hunt anywhere. In 2021, everything is posted and there are cameras taking your photo. Deer hunting especially has changed the hound hunting landscape.

I think two main reasons I want mine to hunt close:
1. Deer. I don’t have much problem with off game, but if they do start something, it’s a whole lot easier to see what is happening close to you, and to put an end to the nonsense as necessary. Skunks are my biggest problem!
2. Cover. If I walk up to a likely looking spot of good cover, I want my hounds to work that out for me. I don’t want them working over in the next field. I work cover WITH my hounds, so don’t want them gone far from me.

[warddog]

Beagle huntsman, that type of hound will get you in trouble here these days be it coon hounds or beagles. The amount of posted land or that which is leased and then posted is staggering here where I live in Indiana. When I had the coon dog described in my post I lived in northern Indiana where there were actually no BIG plots of woods to hunt so one doing as my BIG ole Northern BLUE Hammer bred dog did was bad but not as bad as it would be today. I have since that time moved back to the south western part of the state with more big timber but that has changed since I was born and raised here as a kid. SO MUCH is posted as those city folks which I was one of when kid have moved out into the country and what used to be country is now shopping centers and sub divisions. Those city folks now are moving further out and buying all the old farms as well as mine property and even that is posted to the hilt. I agree with you as I like my beagles to hunt with me and not me hunt with them as they will surely get ME into trouble if they have their own head. This is a state that is cottontails and not many, if any hare so we do not need dogs that get out so far or even run to catch as they most certainly will a cottontail with the amount of cover we have here. About the only places left these days are those that are public state property and an occasional private farm but one has to almost draw a number and wait for it to come up to turn dogs loose. I know of one public state property that allows NO hunting, just running and EVERY time I have been there it has had trucks lined up all along it. I even have seen out of state license plates. I suspect this is part of the cause my old blood lines got away from me as it was becoming more and more apparent that getting pups started was going to be a pretty big task. I do have a place or two of private land but it holds more deer than rabbits. I knew this time would come as I watched things in this state, over my many years of hunting, with and without dogs as I did so withy my dad and granddad's when I was just old enough to walk and keep up with them. Walked many a fields without even carrying a gun and believe I was the dog before we could afford one. LOL

[Shady Grove Beagles]

Warddog
Back in the day I had a nice Bluetick coonhound male named Gunner. I bred him and ended up with a female out of him named Dee.
Dee had been sent as a puppy to a friend in Oklahoma and when I lost a nice young female he let me have her back.
She made a very nice hound. Problem was that when I ran father and daughter together they would push each other right out through the woods and I started finding them treed miles away. They were the reason I ended up buying my first tracking unit.
Hunted solo either dog would hunt out good and check in with me regularly -- hunted together they became a headache of sorts.
Dee was sold for a very good price and the fellow that bought her wrote me a letter saying she was the best dog he ever owned.
That was 28 years ago and I've still got his letter.
You can have a top dog but they still have to hunt in a style that suits you and the way you hunt.

[Shady Grove Beagles]

Beagle Huntsman
I need to revise my statement a little about hunting distances.
I'd say the group of hounds we run hare with in the big north woods do tend to hunt out in the 100 to 200 yard range pretty regularly. It's not like we never see them. They know where we are and do check in as they hunt the cover. The cover is much more open and these hounds and how they are bred do tend to hunt more bird dog style on the run.
I hunted by myself yesterday for 7 hours. The cover was VERY thick. Standing corn and big weed fields and briers. I'd say the only times my girls were more than 50 yards from me was when they were running the rabbit, who for a cottontail was covering some ground.
The hounds seem to adjust as to the country they are hunted in.
Reminded me of some of the comments the English fox hunters shared in that book you sent me.
Again, thanks.

[warddog]

Shady Grove, I will say that big ole bluetick I had was the best coon dog I ever owned as well BUT just not what I liked. He was solidly from Dave Dean's Northern Blue Hammer blood which was big back in my time. In fact I traveled to Michigan to get him from a guy that got him directly from Dave dean. I'm thinking that was back in the early 1980's and I still didn't purchase a tracking collar and like I said came home many nights without him when coon were not moving. This dog was as smart as I had seen. One night my hunting buddy and I had him get treed again in the middle of a section with a small woods in it. As we were walking in we both said that dog is moving from on tree to another, like an idiot. When we got into the tree he had a coon and when we went to the second tree he was moving back and forth from he had the second coon. Never seen another dog do that when the trees were 50 yards apart. I tried everything I could to slow him down even roading him along side my truck the day I was going to hunt him. I thought maybe that would wear him down some to at least stay within the timber we were in BUT to no avail. We had him in a couple nite hunts BUT had to make sure it wasn't a moon lite night so there was a better chance coon were moving. The other thing about him was that whatever way you pointed him is where he shot out to regardless of what the rest of the pack did. Years later I did finally get an old beeper Quik track and wished I had gotten it back then. The other thing was this dog was straight except he loved Grey fox and I could not break him off them. One night hunt he got on one and treed only to leave and move on about ALL night long. My cousin went with us on that nite hunt and said after we finally got back to the club house to NEVER ask him to go with that dog again. I guess ole Doc Holiday broke both of us. LOL Still love the memories.

[main event`s beagles]

this might be a stretch but any information on THE ELORA LINE OF HOUNDS

[main event`s beagles]

sorry i punched it in search bar

[Beagle Huntsman]

Chris, Elora was way back in the 1880s to early 1900s. We all have Elora behind our hounds. Yes, there is a wealth of information on this Board under "Search". It's one reason I hope this Board is never taken down.

[main event`s beagles]

tim, thanks for response

[Shady Grove Beagles]

Some people don't deer hunt.

Small game trophy............

[Shady Grove Beagles]

I know that with today's technology many of the "old ways" are disappearing. I guess I've reached that age where I'm still hanging on to some of them.
I know that most folks when they want their dogs to come in to them just hit "tone" on their electronics and holler for them.
One of mine was out of pocket for a while so I reached in to the storage in the dog box and brought out my old trusty blowing horn. Few long blasts on it and Fly showed up several minutes later.
Many years ago I was coon hunting with a friend in Oklahoma. His herd bull had died out in the field so I went over and pulled one of his horns off and brought it home. Hand sanded it, used a dremel tool to do the lettering, practiced blowing it and have been using it for the past 32 years.
Guys always are asking "do your dogs really come to that?" My answer is always "if they want to........"
Anyone on here ever use a horn for their hounds?

P.S. Even the beagles seem to like it.