Hunt Versus Search

[Chris Spall]

I think that there is a lot of confusion today on the difference between HUNT and SEARCH. Some seem the think that they are one in the same.

We should all know what hunt is.....it's that dog that belly crawls under honeysuckle just to see if there's a rabbit in there, or just marches right on thru the nastiest briers because there might be a rabbit in there.....not because thier handler has sent them in, but because that is where they would rather be....rootin and grubin em out. You have to wonder how this can be confused with search. Have you ever went to look at a dog that it's owner says is a hard hunting hound. You get there and cast the hound and it goes right to work......always on the move, always busy, looking hard for the rabbit, this dog is working it's butt off to find a rabbit.......but this dog is not his best jump dog. He says " this dog has a ton of hunt". Does it have a ton of HUNT or does it have a ton of SEARCH.

[Matt Glomski]

a GREAT jump dog does not have to look busy all the time. They just JUMP RABBITS EVERYWHERE they go. If they go right they jump one if they go left they jump one. I want a dog that can FIND a rabbit and make it look easy. I am not interested in a dog that never breaks stride and can not jump a rabbit ( they look like they are hunting but to me they are just running around). Most of the time a dog like that during gun season (DECEMBER AND JANURARY) doesnt have much luck.

[Incahoots]

I am not interested in a dog that never breaks stride and can not jump a rabbit ( they look like they are hunting but to me they are just running around).

You mean one that looks busy along the edges while other dog/s are working the brush?


Isn't by definition hunt and search about the same?

[tommyg]

Chris a good jump hound don't waste time going into every brush pile or thicket. I belive a great jump hound will search for the hottest track then hunt the rabbit,or find a track it can hunt,I also think it takes smarts. I have a friend that has a hound that hits every brush pile but most of the time another hound jumps the rabbit,she has great hunt but she doesn't produce.

[blackdirt beagles]

[quote="Chris Spall"]
We should all know what hunt is.....it's that dog that belly crawls under honeysuckle just to see if there's a rabbit in there, or just marches right on thru the nastiest briers because there might be a rabbit in there....quote]

i classify that as desire i think... going in the thick and nasty spots.

[DarrinG]

I belive a great jump hound will search for the hottest track then hunt the rabbit,or find a track it can hunt

And how many rabbits bedded in the thickets does it pass up trying to find a "hot track" to work?

Around here I want a dog that belly-crawls into the thickest, nastiest tangles...that is where our rabbits stay the majority of the time. Oh, one that skirts the edges might jump one occasionally, but to consistently get `em up and runnin', they gotta be jumped from their beds, which around here is the nasty thickets, especially up later in the day. I like a dog that has no regard for it's own well being and will bulldoze the toughest briars to jump the rabbit from his briar/thorn thicket, desire to find and run to catch the rabbit!

[tommyg]

I belive a great jump hound will search for the hottest track then hunt the rabbit,or find a track it can hunt

And how many rabbits bedded in the thickets does it pass up trying to find a "hot track" to work?

Around here I want a dog that belly-crawls into the thickest, nastiest tangles...that is where our rabbits stay the majority of the time. Oh, one that skirts the edges might jump one occasionally, but to consistently get `em up and runnin', they gotta be jumped from their beds, which around here is the nasty thickets, especially up later in the day. I like a dog that has no regard for it's own well being and will bulldoze the toughest briars to jump the rabbit from his briar/thorn thicket, desire to find and run to catch the rabbit!

A great jump hound will do what ever it takes,but won't waste time,whats the use to go into brush that a rabbit isn't setting in. But when conditions warrent them getting in to every brush pile they will. I don't want a hound that skirts either but I want one that don't waste time.

[Chris Spall]

Hunt and Search may be about the same by Webster's dictionary, but we all know that some definitions are open to interpretation. Right in Tom's reply he explains the difference so simply "I belive a great jump hound will search for the hottest track then hunt the rabbit,or find a track it can hunt". There it is, one searches for a track while the other Hunts the rabbit. Unfortunatly I wasn't talking about great jump dogs, great jump dogs are in a class of thier own and I don't think that there is any way to mistake them for anything else but a jump dog and don't we all wish we had a kennel full of em. Geography dictates for the most part what kind of hound works the best for us. Snow shoe hare....you don't really jump a Hare, they hear you coming and they get up and go. A hound needs to got out and search for a track and they need to get more than 20 or 30 yards from the hunter. There's generally very little nasty cover like in the south ( brier thickets, black berries, honey suckle, multiflora rose ). The further south you go, the nastier it gets. You take a dog out at 12:00 noon when there isn't any tracks to find and the rabbits are sitting tight, I know what kind of dog I want.

[DarrinG]

whats the use to go into brush that a rabbit isn't setting in

Well, that depends on the size of the brush! Around here some thickets are the size of a football field! If a dog wants to skirt the edges searching for a hot track to work, he wont get you many rabbits running, LOL.. I think alot of this depends on where geographically, the owner/dog hunts.

The further south you go, the nastier it gets. You take a dog out at 12:00 noon when there isn't any tracks to find and the rabbits are sitting tight, I know what kind of dog I want.

Exactly! Early morning rabbits (7:00AM) that are still moving a bit from night-time feeding are pretty easy for a dog to strike and jump, but wait until the noonday sun is high and the rabbits are buried in the multiflora thickets and see how many the skirter jumps!

I think me and Tom would like the same type dog in the hunt department but maybe a little different way of going about it? In any event, good discussion!

[steve]

And since when don't you need a fantastic hunt/ jump dog with nose power when it's 0 degrees or colder and the snow shoes are sitting tight if you think your tough briar dogs are so great bring them up here next winter 2 week of Jan. and we will see if they are able to jump these so called hare that just happen to not need a great dog to get them out of there nice cozy beds.(talking like you know and knowing like you know unless you been there don't talk).Hunting here hunting there,searching here searching there doesn't matter =jumping rabbits/hare.Why is it some guys like to twist words around to make themselves sound better or compensate for there dogs lack of ability just be honest withyour self and cull hard if it can't get the job done.By the why I have a kennel full of hunt/jump dogs that can also bring the rabbit/hare to the gun.

[S.R.Patch]

I was going to say, they've surely never been up north in a big patch a juniper, though I will agree, a hare hound must hunt a bit different to be most effective...Patch

[clousewt]

I want a dog that will go in and push a rabbit out, that to me is hunt and a jump dog. I dont want to have to coax my dogs in either, they have to do it by themselves.

[Chris Spall]

Steve

Sorry if you felt like I or anyone else was stepping on your toes with the reference to hare getting up easier than cottontail. The disscussion isn't to knock a style of hound, but to find out what the perception is of hunt and search. The truth is, it definitely takes a different type of hound to get a hare up than it does to get a cottontail out of it's bed. Having spent a considerable amount of time hunting hare from Houghton lake Michigan north into the U.P. in January, February, and March, I can tell ya....I know the difference.

[tommyg]

I hunt Hare in West Virginia,the hounds have to get out and find a track to run,theres not that many Hare. On Cottentails my hound searches for tracks,all the while she jumps them in thickets. We have super thickets also big ones and if a hound skirts it won't jump rabbits,but I still think that a great jump hound knows where they are,I can't explain it better,they just seem to know.

[Jack]

I don't know if he hunts or searches,but do know a good jump dog just is. I have watched the good jump dog work and he never seems to rush or do a lot wetting down the brush,he just jumps no matter cottontail or hare.