1/2 sister 1/2 brother crosses

[lananbay]

Greg this is the closest linebred/inbred Midwest FC to date
Not just on the top side of Geno if you looked at a 4 gen ped the white oak kennel blood is close too a brother FC White Oak William Henry and sister white oak creek streaker are in the ped within a 3rd gen ped.

Ron maybe you can call up Mr.Tony and he can give you a class on COI! Lol


FC EYERS JERICO PEDEGREE


-------------------------------------NLPC IFC Melanson's Ranger Dan
-----------------------------Eyer's Geno
-------------------------------------FC Workman's Fur Queen Mandy
---------------------FC Eyer's Little Roscoe
-------------------------------------FC Riverbend's Dyna-Mike
-----------------------------Gomer Ridge Fly
--------------------------------------White Oak Creek Streaker
--FC Eyer's Jericho
-------------------------------------NLPC IFC Melanson's Ranger Dan
------------------------------Eyer's Geno
-------------------------------------FC Workman's Fur Queen Mandy
----------------------Eyer's Peek-a-boo
-------------------------------------FC White Oak Creek William Henry
-----------------------------Eyer's Dana
-------------------------------------Blue Sly's Emma

[sparky]

When researching pedigrees I've noticed that most of the horse breeders seem to be lining common ancestors up in the third an fourth generations,their linebreeding not inbreeding. California Chrome is the latest Kentucky Derby winner,he has three common ancestors in five generations,the horse has earned $4,322,650 in his career. There's a lot at stake in the horse world,I'm sure those guys put a lot of time,effort,an research into their breedings. I like to study up on it an try to learn. Anytime there's that kind of money involved (millions) I seriously doubt if those guys are just throwin any two ole horses together an makin a cross,I'm sure there's a lot of thought going into their breeding programs. Like I said I find it interesting an just tryin to learn something from the serious experienced breeders,and the majority of them are linebreeding.

[WELLS WOODS]

I'm not sure how much hunting beagles relate to thoroughbreds; greyhounds maybe. There are so many more traits needed to run a rabbit than conformation, speed & stamina.
lananbay, FC GMC's Primetime Peekaboo was bred very close also:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FTC Branko's Jack Of All Trades
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Branko's Jackpot
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Branko's Ruby Red
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Brent's Prime Time
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------IFC Taylor's Sock It To Me
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Blue Banks Moon Pie
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Camp Creek Gertrude
-------------------------------------------------------------------Peeka
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FTC Branko's Jack Of All Trades
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------IFC Branko's Heli-Prop
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Branko's Speedy Devil
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Gay's Spring Creek Robin
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------IFC Taylor's Sock It To Me
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Elk Creeks Amazing Grace
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Camp Creek Gertrude

Pie & Grace were littermates & both Prop & Jackpot by Jack. Peeka had around 10 AKC licensed wins in the Mid-West.

Also, FC Branko's Boone Creek Trimmer, FC Branko's Proper Tom Cat & FC Branko's Proper Lady Slipper were littermates by Heli-Prop (Jack x Speedy Devil) & Second Hand Rose ( Jack x Spikey).

Don Hoog's latest FC, Talkabout Gertrude is bred close also:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Turbo Powered By Prop
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------IFC Greenwells Reggie
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Maravic's Blue Girl
---------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Chimney Rocks Ky Lucky
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Brent's Prime Time
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Wells Woods Blue Sue
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Journeys End Scoot To Me Sadie
--------------------------------------------------------------------Gertrude
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Branko's Jackpot
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Brent's Prime Time
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Blue Banks Moon Pie
----------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Talkabout Kellie
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Turbo Powered By Prop
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------FC Talkabout Calie
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Shaw's Oakwood Callie

[sparky]

Branko's Olympus was trialed in the Midwest,and won the AKC Nationals,if I'm not mistaken I think he had a COI% somewhere around 19-20% which is pretty high. Chubby Checkers also trialed in the Midwest had a high COI%, it's been a while since I looked them up,but I think his was around 19-20% as well.

[WELLS WOODS]

How much COI does an inbred ( father/daughter, mother/son or littermate brother-sister cross) hound usually have? ballpark? It should be really high since this is where health defects occur more often.
How much COI does Peeka-Boo have?
Does COI tell how closely bred a hound is or just how many common ancestors their parents have? Can an inbred hound show less COI than a linebred hound ?

[Ron Conroe]

1 or 2 out of how many fc's in the mid-west, what's the coi on that.

[sparky]

It's pretty easy to Google "Coefficient Of Inbreeding" there's a lot of information about it that will answer your questions a lot better than I can,if you care to take the time to look it up.

As far as horses go,I'm not comparing the two,just simply stating that the big time breeders are mostly linebreeding to get the best,although I will say horses are pretty complicated animals too,and horse breeders are way more advanced in their knowledge of breeding. Like I said before,it doesn't matter to me how anyone chooses to breed their animals,I just try to learn as much as possible about it,because I think it's interesting.

There are definitely more than just one or two dogs that have finished in the Midwest that are linebred,a lot of Branko dogs in the Midwest,and most are lined with Jack Of All Trades.

No offense to anyone,but I would rather take the opinion/advice of an actual experienced breeder that has had great success over someone that just has an opinion.

[Shady Grove Beagles]

I'm sure most folks have noticed that I.F.C. Greenwell's Reggie's mother Maravic's Blue Girl is the result of a half brother sister cross with both her sire and dam being out of I.F.C. Maravic's Blue Ninja.

[BM Orchard]

I don't know how closely related lab rats are to humans but that's what are used for testing. Glad it's them instead of me. Horses are not beagles but I agree it's an example of breeding programs that can be observed. Regardless of how are why anyone chooses to bred past success should always be recognized. Good ones come from a lot of different places & bloodlines but lining up on what you like only makes sense.

[WELLS WOODS]

The most common dog in Branko blood is Anna's Ann. Everything goes back to her, so it's usually on both sides of the pedigree. I've noticed FC Leitza's Girl a lot in northern Michigan bred dogs. Camp Creek Gertrude & FC Chippewa's Red Maiden were two bitches that several good hounds trace back to also. Most successful breeders have a good bitch line they started with.
Back to inbreeding, it has had it's place in the past. They did it with Mt. Zion Pete some. FC Lakeside Snowflake was inbred Pete. Pacesetter has a lot of Snowflake blood. Ali-Baba's dam, Double Ann was inbred Branko's Conman. A more recent Mid-West FC, Abshire's Levee Rd. Junie's dam was inbred Kingwoods T-Rex. I'm too scared of health problems myself to inbreed hounds. I'll stick to distant linebreeding & outcrossing.

[sparky]

Nice LineBreeding in the pedigree you posted a couple days ago under Ison's Colonel Cobalt's stud add,the cross of Cobalt x Strange Daze Bella has three crosses of PrimeTime and two crosses of Silver Star in four generations. Hope you get the big females you want,looks like a nice cross.

[WELLS WOODS]

Thanks. I'm no breeder; just hoping for a blessing from the Lord.

[S.R.Patch]

I have never thought of making a cross like this before, never in my mind I would line breed until I got this female. I like her a lot, yes she has faults but very few that I can deal with. The male I am going to cross her with is very explosive and I've seen him do some remarkable stuff in the past. Seen this 13 inch male run down a healthy swamp rabbit. This male is the fastest hound I ever saw. I understand with line breeding you can double up on some bad traits, but for you all out there that has done it, what did you get both positive and negative.
Thank you

I bought some pups from a popular line one time that were family bred. None panned out to be good hounds, so I bought a young adult hound from this line and she developed into a very nice hound. When wanting to breed her, I asked around from others with the line and even the breeder and was told her uncle was available and should use him on the cross. Well, the whole litter was a disaster of faults, physically and mentally. None had multiple faults, one had crooked front, another had a knot in his tail, one had a bulldog bite, the two i kept alive never showed any desire to hunt even at a yr old so i decided I didn't want to promote hounds that were so late to develop or show any interest. The line had many good hounds in it, the only thing I could figure was I had and was mixing the wrong ones or something. There was a lot of work that needed done but the field trial results had blinded me.
The whole thing I learned was to look at the pedigree at the breeding relationship of the hounds up to your prospect. Go talk to the owners and breeders, their honesty about the hounds and the percentages of good "hunting" hounds from them will make or break your endeavor. I was looking for rabbitdawgs firstly, field trials results with champions was just icing on the cake that said some folks thought highly of the hound. I wanted rabbit dogs that I could count on and from them I could expect to get a respectable percentage of like kind in breeding. I had read Patchwork from Randall and was on the hunt to get what he had planted in my mind.
Every first breeding is an experiment of how the two individuals will nick, one breeding doesn't cement the mix but is proven through repeat crossing and the percentages resulting. When you find two hounds you like, breeding them together is a totally different proposition of what the genes will give you. the more a number of the hounds are alike in type and ancestry, the better your odds.
A buddy of mine had a hound from Leitza's Go Patch that was an outstanding hare hound, but we never got to breed her before she died.
Good luck with your breeding...

[WELLS WOODS]

lananbay, back on your pedigree of Jericho, I don't think Streaker & William Henry were related. Scott Music would know. W.Henry was a great hound & probably Turbo's first FC.
Casey, Talking about breeding half sister/brother. I was looking at Hall of Fame hound, FC Birch Lake Texas T 's pedigree last night & his sire FC Dom's Dougie came from parents both directly by FC Kurt's Lad & Texas T's dam was from two hounds directly by IFC Mt. Zion Pete.

[Alabama John]

Most of the AKC champion dogs were not inbred or close kin. By far most Beagles hunted with are not either, they call it accidental bred and most kill the pups when born.

Once I saw a chart that showed the percentages of AKC champions that were not, and were. Of course a kennel would tout doing this as it sells more of their home bred pups and field trial dogs inbred from their high dollar dogs.

Big kennels are a business after all. Culling hard is spoken like its a science to see which pup is deformed or has various problems. Most 3rd graders could do just as well.

Why is doing this inbreeding against the law for humans? Should breeding like this make them better doctors, mechanics, runners, etc?

Don't get too caught up in the BS surrounding this as you can be easily mislead by the best salesman trying to impress you with their breeding knowledge and while at it try to make you seem stupid for not agreeing.

Ever see the movie Deliverance?