POLL- SYRIAN INTERVENTION YES/NO?

[Bev]

There is no good side to the war in Syria. It's a lose-lose. We need to step back, let them do what they will, and let God sort that mess out. Until they are a direct threat to the U.S., or until the U.N. says go, I say "no." That country may need to implode.

Typical stance for a pro life person. None of your concern ,if they use sarin gas on live Syrian children and babies. Since their not Unborn Americans . Not saying I am for bombing Syria , just do not understand your selective prolife attitude.

APFII, there's nothing selective whatsoever about my pro-life attitude. I don't believe in capital punishment, either. When I say there's no good side to that war it's because there isn't, not that I think it's okay for people to die as long as they aren't in this country. But please tell me, where was all this need for action with the first 100,000 Syrian people Assad killed? It's okay to die by guns, bombs, and beheadings, but not gas? Both factions in this war are evil people, ergo - no good side. Either side we assist, we are aiding a bunch of murderous thugs. If we go over there and drop a 15-ton bomb on Syria, I guarant-darn-tee you we will also be killing a lot of Syrian children and babies, and become murderous thugs ourselves. Not to mention we may as well draw a big red target on Israel. This is not our war unless Congress says it's our war.

And you can take your snide comments about "typical pro-life people" and stick them where the sun doesn't shine.

[Pine Lakes]

God knows us as we are in the womb. Its a life now why syria kills there own people i can care less, we have abortions across this country every minute of the day. However to us as a used to be christian nation its ok. Its not ok. Vote no.

If you believe in things like "god" and such, then ya, I could see where you might have a problem with it.. BUT, not everyone believes in god and it is their right to believe in whatever they want and it is protected under the constitution.

You have NO RIGHT WHATSOEVER, to push your beliefs on the general population of society as far as the law is concerned. Preach to them and convert them, fine, but you cannot legislate Christian values onto society..

The Salem Witch Trials, slavery, persecuting gays, temperance, are all failures of religion on our society. We do not need the bible to run our country. I realize I am a minority on this and since I have a bible degree I know it sounds weird coming from me but Christianity is a bane on this country and not the blessing you guys see it as. It is a crutch we use to excuse our behaviors and an ideal we can't live up too.

Bev- I will watch that video tonight (it is blocked on my network right now). Thank you for letting this thread stay up.

You are so messed up in the head that I don't think anyone can help you. First of all real Christianity does not condone such behavior so your cherry picking of the salem witch trials, slavery, and others that happened a century or more ago is stupid. There is lunacy in every walk of life. Second of all the "separation of church and state" was made not to protect the state from the church, but to protect the church from the state. Outside of a very few, our for fathers were overwhelmingly christians of some sort and their moral prowess is owed to that. It is that very moral prowess that put our constitution into words. Have you ever researched what our founding fathers felt about Jesus and Christianity? What I find ironic is that they didn't state that in order to be american you had to be christian, but yet it is heathens like you that attack the very source of morality that grant you the freedom to believe whatever you want. In essence you are stating that anyone of Christian faith should not influence the political realm and those that believe Jesus was not our savior should make our laws. We may not need the Bible to run this country, but men of moral decency are its backbone. As an open minded individual, the more I see the influence of the Bible fade from our social fabric, the farther from moral decency we get and our country is loathing because of it. If atheists and other less tolerant religions could put their hate for christians and the laws of descency aside then we may be able to salvage it. Me, I fear it is going to come to war and I'm prepared to deal with those that wish to push their immortality into my life. Just so you know, those that use christianity as a shield to due evil deeds are the lowest form of life and I have ideas for them too. Without some sort of moral compass, we are all wild animals that will live without regret and consideration.

I can't see how we can justify going to war with a country that isn't directly threatening us while we have few jobs, a high crime rate, and children suffering inside of our own borders. It's ironic how some of these liberals who hated Bush for invading Iraq, are in support of invading Syria. Do they not know how many of his own people Saddam gassed? Hell, Mexico is a greater threat at this point.

[Casey Harner]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IAhDGYlpqY

[adirondackjoe]

i've read the bible. it just doesn't seem to make sense.

[Pine Lakes]

i've read the bible. it just doesn't seem to make sense.

Could you be any more vague? Nevermind, I don't want a thread searching for people's opinion of going to war with Syria to turn into a religious free for all. I'll part with, if you let the life of Jesus influence how you live, that is a good thing for everyone, even those that don't believe. A good example was the founding of our country.

Casey, thanks for posting that video. It is very influential and true.

[Mo. Beagler 5000]

Without some sort of moral compass, we are all wild animals that will live without regret and consideration.

That is EXACTLY what we are, animals. Living in a society trying to all survive. There IS NO moral compass we have to live by. You can create a god if you like but it doesn't make it real or something we all have to adhere too. Literally the only thing separating us from them is that it was evolutionary advantageous for us to develop big brains to deal with the world and keep track of social situations.

I also VEHEMENTLY disagree that our founding fathers were Christian and most of them spoke about how silly it was. Have you ever actually read Franklin, Washington, locke or Adams in their own words? They are pretty damning of the Christian god.

Furthermore, give me something that has had a positive affect of Christianity on society... You can't use morals because even pagans have morals. Even 50,000 years ago we have evidence that early humans had functioning societies. We do not need a god to live by. We make morals as we go. I find it funny how most of the bible you guys ignore, Women having cut hair and not wearing dresses, gluttony, drinking, smoking, tattoos, now you are changing your stance on gays, working on the sabbath or running your hounds on it, and the list goes on and on and on. Its comical how your "moral compass" changes in every generation.

Here is one of my favorite quotes of all time:

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing but doesn't? Then he is evil
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

[Mo. Beagler 5000]

Mo.Beagler 5000, ain't you glad your mother decided not to have an abortion when she was carrying you?? We'll be praying for you.

I am also glad I didn't get hit by a bus, have a meteor land on me, or have some crappy genetic dysfunction that made me handicapped. The list goes on forever. Quotes like that are not meaningful in anyway....

Begles I hate to say it but I don't see everyone getting along ever again, this country has become so divided. I remember when prayer and the pledge where taken out of school. As I have gotten older I can understand prayer as there are people who are non christians but the pledge, I say if your allegience isn't here go where ever in the he!! it is. Same thing with same sex marriage, I don't have a problem with gays or lesbians but don't try and call it marriage because it can't naturally further civilization, period. Same with abortion I don't believe in it but if a women makes that discision its on her as long as I in NO way am forced through my tax dollars to fund it. I don't believe in taking from one man something he earned to give to another who did nothing to earn it. I could go on and on and on, truth is people have become less and less dependent holding themslves accountable and responsible for themselves and more and more dependent on someone else providing them a safty net.

I agree 100 percent about the pledge. If you are not with us, you are against us, period... About same sex marriage though; marriage is whatever we want to define it as. If you don't like it then rewrite the tax code to not given heterosexual married couples tax breaks. Christians don't have a monopoly on that. It wasn't long ago that Catholics and protestants couldn't marry either... Religion is seriously a scourge, look at the vitriol on this board alone.. Crusades and hate speech and I just wish you guys would realize you are a fading minority and one day the world is going to look back on you guys and wonder how you even existed ot begin with. It is already happening and nothing you can do will stop it. Look at Europe.

[Casey Harner]

Without some sort of moral compass, we are all wild animals that will live without regret and consideration.

That is EXACTLY what we are, animals. Living in a society trying to all survive. There IS NO moral compass we have to live by. You can create a god if you like but it doesn't make it real or something we all have to adhere too. Literally the only thing separating us from them is that it was evolutionary advantageous for us to develop big brains to deal with the world and keep track of social situations.

I also VEHEMENTLY disagree that our founding fathers were Christian and most of them spoke about how silly it was. Have you ever actually read Franklin, Washington, locke or Adams in their own words? They are pretty damning of the Christian god.

Furthermore, give me something that has had a positive affect of Christianity on society... You can't use morals because even pagans have morals. Even 50,000 years ago we have evidence that early humans had functioning societies. We do not need a god to live by. We make morals as we go. I find it funny how most of the bible you guys ignore, Women having cut hair and not wearing dresses, gluttony, drinking, smoking, tattoos, now you are changing your stance on gays, working on the sabbath or running your hounds on it, and the list goes on and on and on. Its comical how your "moral compass" changes in every generation.

Here is one of my favorite quotes of all time:

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing but doesn't? Then he is evil
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

My favorite line in a song is in your signature. I don't know which part you like but I'm guessing its the GOD is great part. If you didn't believe in God, your signature would not be what it is. God is great and he loves you... Good running to you sir...

[Rabbithoundjb]

I don't claim to be Christian, your assumptions are making an azz out of you. I believe in TRADITIONAL family values period. If you love Europe move to Europe. We people with values, principles, ethics, a clear vision of right and wrong may be a fading minority that would explain why the country is heading downhill fast. No one day this country is going to implode because of people with the same view point as you. So you want a fair tax code for same sex couples, I want a fair tax code for everyone. I think everyone should pay their fair share. See you want to soak it to some and give breaks to others, didn't I read where you said something about consistency.

HHHMMM I don't claim to be Christian nor do I claim to know if the founding fathers where but I bet they sure as he!! didn't believe that they evolved from apes. evolution is a bigger joke than your making the bible out to be. Tell me why aren't people still evolving from apes, monkeys etc.

Even though I don't claim to be Christian, Christianity adds structure if all people Christian or not just followed the 10 commandments oh how much better the world would be.

[mybeagles]

Mo Beagler 5000,

You didn't comprehend much of your Biblical studies if you can't get past the question of evil. That's covered in the introductory classes.

I will agree with some of what you say....religion (mans attempt to please God), is deeply flawed because it involves mankind. Also, legalism is detrimental.

However, nothing in the Bible or Christianity is detrimental to a nation. A simple glance at history with prove that over and over again.

Everyone knows there is a God....even the devils believe and tremble....it's just the fools who say in their heart that God doesn't exist. Not sure where you stand on all of this but don't blame or deny God

I also VEHEMENTLY disagree that our founding fathers were Christian and most of them spoke about how silly it was. Have you ever actually read Franklin, Washington, locke or Adams in their own words? They are pretty damning of the Christian god.

Not sure where you studied, but a quick read of this nations founding documents will blow holes in your comments. While you did choose the names of the weaker supporters of Christianity, even those three acknowledged God as their Creator and essential for the good of the nation.

I really think you know better and are just stirring the pot, but you are coming across as extremely ignorant and distasteful.

[Mo. Beagler 5000]

I don't claim to be Christian, your assumptions are making an azz out of you. I believe in TRADITIONAL family values period. If you love Europe move to Europe. We people with values, principles, ethics, a clear vision of right and wrong may be a fading minority that would explain why the country is heading downhill fast. No one day this country is going to implode because of people with the same view point as you. So you want a fair tax code for same sex couples, I want a fair tax code for everyone. I think everyone should pay their fair share. See you want to soak it to some and give breaks to others, didn't I read where you said something about consistency.

HHHMMM I don't claim to be Christian nor do I claim to know if the founding fathers where but I bet they sure as he!! didn't believe that they evolved from apes. evolution is a bigger joke than your making the bible out to be. Tell me why aren't people still evolving from apes, monkeys etc.

Even though I don't claim to be Christian, Christianity adds structure if all people Christian or not just followed the 10 commandments oh how much better the world would be.

We are still evolving, it never stops, we are talking on a time scale of BILLIONS of years. You would never see it occur in a single lifetime or even twenty life times, but as sure as the earth is round, the DNA you pass to your children is not 100 percent the same as the sum of their parts. That is a fact. If you look at humans over the past 20k to 50k years you can clearly see we interbred with the neanderthals and we can even trace back the DNA back to it. It would be even more pronounced had we of not learned how to make our environment evolve towards our needs instead of the other way around.

Had you of grown up in an area that values science and human progress you would know all about it but it is easier to stick your head in the sand than to change your preconceived beliefs. I used to believe in god and was an actual pastor but after actually reading about science, evolution and actually went to a place where they did carbon dating and looked at how we calculate the age of the earth and stars, etc.. it just became impossible to believe the god of the bible because if he lied to us about where we came from then why should we trust him about where we are going? I cried myself to sleep for months before giving up the faith and tried to make the bible fit into my beliefs but its wrong.

If I could get on my knees and ask forgiveness to every person I told was going to hell or condemned for being gay or having an abortion or even cheating on their spouse I would. It cost me a lot of relationships and I have had to make piece with it. Evolution is fac and if you seriously want some evidence for it, I will lead you in the right direction but if its just so you can try and deny it, then whats the point? let me know bud.

[Newt]

"If I could get on my knees and ask forgiveness to every person I told was going to hell or condemned for being gay or having an abortion or even cheating on their spouse I would. It cost me a lot of relationships and I have had to make piece with it."

If that is an indication of your claim of being a Bible Scholar, it showsan absence of scholarship. The Bible repeatedly tells us to "ignore the tares" and that you are not the judge of a persons salvation.
You were following the "traditions of man" and not the teachings of Jesus.
You can ask for forgiveness. Your sins will be blotted out. It could cost you a lot more than friends if you don't

On another subject: A List Of Children Killed By Drone Strikes In Pakistan and Yemen by the Noble Peace Prize recipient

http://www.policymic.com/articles/24164 ... -and-yemen

[Mo. Beagler 5000]

"If I could get on my knees and ask forgiveness to every person I told was going to hell or condemned for being gay or having an abortion or even cheating on their spouse I would. It cost me a lot of relationships and I have had to make piece with it."

If that is an indication of your claim of being a Bible Scholar, it showsan absence of scholarship. The Bible repeatedly tells us to "ignore the tares" and that you are not the judge of a persons salvation.
You were following the "traditions of man" and not the teachings of Jesus.
You can ask for forgiveness. Your sins will be blotted out. It could cost you a lot more than friends if you don't

On another subject: A List Of Children Killed By Drone Strikes In Pakistan and Yemen by the Noble Peace Prize recipient

http://www.policymic.com/articles/24164 ... -and-yemen

Ya, lets talk about how many people god kills everyday.. Oh ya, everyone of them. He creates them, and then entices them to sin and when they do, kills them for it and give the entire world a perpetual death sentence. In the bible god literally is responsible for killing over 2 million people. "everyone is too evil for me so I want you to build this boat where you will have incest and all these animals like penguins that you don't know how to take care of or even know you exist on it" God.... And who again is the crazy one in this conversation? The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. If I ever saw god I would punch it right in the face for all the suffering he has caused. And yet, it is the Satan guy we should be fearing? He never sent anyone to hell, that is all gods doing...

And again you are taking the bible context you want... Or do you not read the parts about, expelling the immoral brother and a spiritual man makes judgements about ALL things... I know my bible and can quote an awful lot of scriptures to argue anything you say.... Thats what makes it false. Not only is it subjective but its demonstrably false.

Ever wonder why so many people in different regions have different religions? You have the same religion you are taught, not because it is true but because that was what you have been around. Do you really think you would be Christian if you grew up in Iran?

There is 0 evidence for god and overwhelming pile against it, especially the christian one...

[Rabbithoundjb]

You have drunk the academia Kool-Aid 5000, the leftist non-sense. If indeed evolution from apes, monkeys, pigs, and any other animal to human existed like you said you would see it because it would be happening all the time in different stages. I see evolution everyday but its the lose of self pride, self worth, self achievement, self accountability, self responsibility, morals, ethics, respect, discipline, honor, honesty and so on that every younger generation is loosing more and more of. Oh yea I recognize evolution it's right in front of us just not the non sense you are trying to sell.

[Bev]

There is zero proof that man evolved from primordial ooze. There is simply no science that supports evolution. But I do think we're getting closer to finding the missing link.