The American Beagler Forum

In Little Pack if someone in a cast wants a dog measured do they have to measure the entire cast? This happened today and I wasn't aware of this rule. No dogs measured out.

No they do not have to measure the whole cast it can be one dog or however many a handler wants but to be nice about i think a lot of guys are going to ask to have the whole cast measured just to not single any one out.And by the way that was a dirty trick you guys played on me yesterday i dont know if my face showed it but i was freaking out at the thought that my dog ran a deer.But we laughed about it all the way home another great memory from field trailing.

Ryan,
What did you run yesterday? I never got a chance to ask you how they ran or where you ran. It wasn`t the best running we`ve ever had. Seemed like a lot od does to me. The dog that won the last trial minused out in 15 mins in the first cast I judged. Then the one that got second minused out in another cast the same round. Thats crazy. They were both tough dogs, but like the story goes, I guess it wasn`t there day...
About the measuring of the whole cast, I never heard of that myself either. But, the judge requested I do it, and in all respect for any judge at our trial;REQUEST GRANTED. Get a PM to Paul Pevot and ask him if they were doing that at the world hunt. Eric said it happened in a cast he ran. I never seen it personally, but I beleive him. I`ll try to post the results on this site after while. Thanks for coming to all, and the help. Kevin

Yes, I know that is what Eric said but I believe that was a differnt sittuation. I am also wondering who can the breed inspector have hold the dogs for mesurment. I thought it said they could ask for the handler of each dog to help.I don't think the handler in that cast (and aslo the one that requested a dog be measured) can assest in holding ALL the dogs in the cast. I know people were asking about that and I believe that was not a good idea.......lol. both my opens ran at the same place. The place where your female won her first cast. There were alot of rabbits there both times just tuff running. Your female won with 3 strikes and 2 jumps and a check. She hunted her butt off they just couldnt fdo much with them after they were up. The 2nd time I went there was prety much the same thing. my dog took 2nd with a check. That place wasnt real thick so it didn't seem like there would be manny rabbits there but it was loaded.

Ryan

I have never heard of a judge asking for a hound to be measured .

The handler of one of the hounds in the cast can ask for any, or all dogs, in a cast to be measured.

Here is what the rules say:

VII. Breed Inspector

1. Each club is to select a Breed Inspector for the hunt. This person is to be knowledgeable concerning breed standards.

2. The host club has the option of whether or not to measure the
hounds before the hunt; however, any handler may challenge the
size of the hound, and such hound must be measured before
advancing any further in the hunt. If a handler is going to challenge
the size of the hound it must be done at the staging area before the
hounds go out in the field at the beginning of any cast. The handler
should inform the judge of the cast he is challenging the size of the
hound. The judge will request a measurement by the Breed
Inspector. If the hound is found to be oversized it is disqualified.
No other challenge to the hound’s size can be made except at the
casting area. Once a dog is challenged and found to be under 15”
by the breed inspector the dog can not be challenged again that day
at the same hunt

3. The Breed Inspector makes the final decision as to whether the
challenged hound shall be allowed to hunt.

4. The Breed Inspector has the right to measure all hounds that are
entered in the hunt and to disqualify any hound that, in his opinion,
does not meet breed standards, or is over 15 inches at the withers.

5. The Breed Inspector must have available for use an official
measuring stand. An official measuring scale, is any type of
device that measures 15", and cannot be proven otherwise, shall be
that club’s official measuring scale.

6. The Breed Inspector shall determine whether a hound qualifies for
ARHA registration. The Breed Inspector shall check AKC and
UKC registration papers for hounds being registered and write the
AKC or UKC registration number on the ARHA registration form.

7. The club secretary shall issue a form signed by the Breed Inspector
stating that said hound has been registered with ARHA at that club
on that date. This form shall be filled out in duplicate. One copy
shall be sent to ARHA for registration. The second is to be given to
the dog’s owner to be presented at subsequent hunts until the
official ARHA number is received by the owner. No hound shall
be entered without an ARHA number or the above proof of
registration unless he is registered at the hunt.

8. When being measured, a hound shall be standing in a natural, alert
position with its head up but not stretched upward and with its feet
well under the hound and forelegs vertical. The hound shall be
placed on a non-slippery surface at floor or ground level. The
hound shall not be required to be posed, or set up as in a bench
show pose by the measurer.

Here is more

G. Reasons a Hound Must Be Disqualified

10. A hound that has been inspected by the Breed Inspector and
found to be oversized shall be disqualified. If a hound is
disqualified because of measuring over 15 inches it is mandatory
that the name, ARHA number, and owner of the hound be reported
on the same page of the reporting form as the off-game runners are
reported. Any hound measured and found to be oversized 3
different times by 3 different breed inspectors, in the lifetime of the
dog, shall be banned from all future competition.

Yeah the field near the pond was loaded with rabbit's. We seen three rabbit's in less than a minute. On the second round we went to the field located just in bluff city. It took the dog's 45 to find a rabbit. In the last 15 minutes they found one and it was well worth it. That rabbit ran and ran.....Dog's did a good job at keeping it going.

Joey, we went back to that same pond area the 2nd round and it was the same thing ( rabbits everywhere ) SilverZuk, The question I am asking is if a handler in a cast asks for one dog to be measured, do they have to measure every dog in the cast? I know someone can ask for every dog to be measured, but this wasn't the case. Because of a cast at the World this year, the judge last weekend was under the impression that if someone asked for a measurment the whole cast had to be measured. I wasn't aware of this and wasn't sure if he had the wrong impression or if this was something they just started. I didn't know for sure and I figgured if it was something that just started other people might not know.

Yeah, Gotcha Ryan. SilverZuk, that pretty much answers the rule on measuring. As for my helping hand at the stand, I had no idea who asked for the dogs to be measured. Your 100% right. That did probably look bad. Sorry for that. When your trying to get all the casts somewhere to run, a guide for each one, and take your cast out to Judge yourself its hard to keep track of everything else going on. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. Thats the first time we`ve ever had to measure a dog in a cast and I wanted to make sure not to get any of them all humped up. I think next time I will ask the handler to hold there collar for me instead of our club president. There were a couple dogs there in other casts that would`ve been close, but none in that cast looked oversized to me. The ? still remains:"do you as a breed inspector have to measure the entire cast of hounds if someone questions the size of just 1 hound."??? I don`t think thats right the way I READ THE RULE. But like I said before. If one who is judging for me request that, I will do it. I will clear this up with a little phone call this evening. Remember, the judge requesting this is the Illinois state rep. for LP.

Ryan,

The breed inspector has the right to measure every hound, but is not required to measure every hound in the cast unless all hounds are challenged. Only the challenged hound or hounds MUST be measured. Also, there is no rule that says the breed inspector can't touch the hound. The hound just can not be posed. If the hound will not stand, then you may request assistance from the handler.

Hope this helps

Thanks PAUL,
I was hoping you would read this and clear it up. What should be done next time if the judge insists they all be measured, because thats how they did it at the world hunt. The world hunt does set an example for the way its supposed to be done. There was nothing lost by all the dogs being measured and none of the hounds measured out. The dog in question by the handler measured 14 5/8 and the rest were smaller than that.

Kevin, I wasn't upset or anything, I just wasn't sure about having to measure them all if one dog was challenged. The judge thought they all had to be measured, and he started to convince me......lol. You did the right thing. I think the handler was just wanting to try out the new stand. I know you were in a hurry to get the casts out and didn't know who wanted the dog measured.

I think we finally got this thing resolved. I just talked to Ron Eades. He said that the only dog that should have been measured was the one challenged by the handler. This is the way it will be done next time. Also, another handler in a cast at the World Hunt asked for all the dogs to be measured. They only had to measure all of them in the cast Eric was in, because another handler said that she wanted them all measured. Funny how things get twisted so easily. Well Ryan, may seeya around. I need to go to another trial somewhere to get Gracie some points elsewhere. Do you know of any halfway close coming up?

I don't know of any close hunts. How did Gracie end up? She put on a show in our first cast. That young guy that ran her had a big smile after the cast...