Hey guys,
I was at a trial and saw a guy that used a horn from an old 18 wheeler. Worked fine when he blew it. I do not ask if he did anything to it. I am going to get one to try. This should not be too expensive.
Trash running 101
Moderators: Pike Ridge Beagles, Aaron Bartlett
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Spruce Ridge Beagler
- Posts: 955
- Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 1:22 pm
- Location: Gowen MI
I blow the horn just before feeding time. Then I carry a pocketful of dog feed while runnung the dogs. Blow the horn and when they come to me I give them a treat. They learn this very quick. Seems to me that useing the tone button would tell the dog that if he don't get his butt in gear and come in he will get burnt, hence a collar wise hound. Do you fellow always collar the dogs up. I just ordered a new collar and when it arrived there was no dummy collar in the case. I called and they said not many people use them any more. Myself I am a firm user of the dummy collar and my dogs mind very well and are not collar wise. But it takes some time and the use of the dummy collar.
Spruce Ridge, I'm not sure how that converts to U.S. funds......I think you double it but not entirely sure. As to distance with the horn, I've got neighbors more than a mile away that have heard me calling the dogs in and thats with leaves out and some wind. Jack, thats exactly how I first started training my older hounds for the horn, toot'in on it at feed time. I think all my dogs are collar wise and I pretty much dont run a dog without a collar on it. I think that if you do any kind of obedience training with e-collars it wont take the dog long to figure out that you and the collar are the source of the discomfort when the dog tests your commands.
It's not that life is short......it's just that we're dead for such a long, long time...
How do you know if the dogs are coming in, if they are up to a mile away how do you know if they are coming towards you or going away? Do you give them a certain amount of time before you correct them with the collars? One last thing, should we want or expect our hounds to leave a chase to come in? Should they leave a check to come in?
I remember a couple months ago when this all seemed easy and fun, now I spend more time worrying about them and if I'm screwing them up than enjoying them. I hope this too passes.
I remember a couple months ago when this all seemed easy and fun, now I spend more time worrying about them and if I'm screwing them up than enjoying them. I hope this too passes.
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Alabama John
- Posts: 2116
- Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2002 5:56 pm
- Location: Pinson, Alabama
Sav
Just enjoy your dogs and don't expect them to obey like a German Sheperd.
Don't expect or require them to come off a rabbit to be loaded up. We call ours when young pups and put them on a rabit when its seen that they are running. They learn to come to us when we call and be put on the rabbit where we saw it and shortcut the rabbit trail.
When we have to go while they are running, we lie and make like we saw the rabbit.
Only put shock collars on young dogs and use when certain they are running anything but a rabbit. If have to use it several times, dog is gone to a new home. Wenever shock for any other ereason. Seen many dogs ruined by folks shocking for coming in, coldtrailing, eating dead stuff, barking in box, growling at another dog, not starting hunting quick enough, jumping up on strangers leg to be petted, sniffing females to see if they are ready for some romance, you get the idea.
In my opinion, the shock collar only replaces the limb and is used exactly for what a limb was used for when you are not able to catch the dog and whip it. No one ever used a limb to call in dogs.
Just enjoy your dogs and don't expect them to obey like a German Sheperd.
Don't expect or require them to come off a rabbit to be loaded up. We call ours when young pups and put them on a rabit when its seen that they are running. They learn to come to us when we call and be put on the rabbit where we saw it and shortcut the rabbit trail.
When we have to go while they are running, we lie and make like we saw the rabbit.
Only put shock collars on young dogs and use when certain they are running anything but a rabbit. If have to use it several times, dog is gone to a new home. Wenever shock for any other ereason. Seen many dogs ruined by folks shocking for coming in, coldtrailing, eating dead stuff, barking in box, growling at another dog, not starting hunting quick enough, jumping up on strangers leg to be petted, sniffing females to see if they are ready for some romance, you get the idea.
In my opinion, the shock collar only replaces the limb and is used exactly for what a limb was used for when you are not able to catch the dog and whip it. No one ever used a limb to call in dogs.
Here is an example the dangers of shocking dogs to call them in. A couple years ago me and my buddy and I were out running our dogs. Soon we heard some other beagles running. As they circled their rabbit they came closer, then had a check. During the check they heard our beagles running and immediately came an joined. I noticed one or two had shock collars. After a few minutes the dogs indicated they were getting shocked severly. One would squall and come runnig toward one of us. He thought he was obeying his training in coming back to his master. Then he was shocked again, over and over. I could hear the other hunters calling the dog then he would shock him. The poor dog was so confused that he could not detect the distant voice. We walked quickly, about a quarter of a mile, toward the mans voice. When we got close enough we started yelling telling him to quit shocking the dog.
I suspect if a PETA or other animal rights individual had witnessed the episode the owner would have been dragged into court.
In flat land, calling the dogs with a shock collar may be an option. In mountains or hill country it's iffy.
I suspect if a PETA or other animal rights individual had witnessed the episode the owner would have been dragged into court.
In flat land, calling the dogs with a shock collar may be an option. In mountains or hill country it's iffy.
If your dogs are a mile away in the terrain I run in then your trashbreaker probably wont reach them, in fact I'll bet it wont. You'll be using your tracker to find your dogs at that point. The key to get them recalling properly is to get it right in training so you dont have to blast them when out in the deep stuff doing it for real. I put bells on my dogs and turn them out .......they go in and when I cant hear the bells anymore I toot the horn and use the e-collar appropriately. Repetition is the way to go, over and over and over. Pretty soon I dont have to use the e-collar anymore. No I wouldnt expect my dogs to leave a chase to come in. Have I shocked them off a chase to bring them back to me?........yes......did it ruin them?......no. An e-collar set up is just a tool and like any tool it all depends on how ya use it as to how effective it will be. A hammer won't cut down a tree real well will it? Most folks that have problems simply arent applying the tool properly.sav wrote:How do you know if the dogs are coming in, if they are up to a mile away how do you know if they are coming towards you or going away? Do you give them a certain amount of time before you correct them with the collars? One last thing, should we want or expect our hounds to leave a chase to come in? Should they leave a check to come in?
I remember a couple months ago when this all seemed easy and fun, now I spend more time worrying about them and if I'm screwing them up than enjoying them. I hope this too passes.
Last edited by NorWester on Fri Aug 04, 2006 2:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
It's not that life is short......it's just that we're dead for such a long, long time...
Thanks for all the feed back guys it really is appreciated, I guess I'll keep working with them in the yard before I run them again, they are good at coming in, but once bitten twice shy. The one and only concern I have is, I simply don't know what they are doing once out of sight, how can I correct the action if I can't see it? Like Gus said they may get confused trying to find me and shocking them won't help that situation, I've already seen them run straight away from me thinking they where coming in, but they where running towards my echo.
I wish tracking collars weren't so darn expensive!!
I wish tracking collars weren't so darn expensive!!
That IS a great example of the dangers of improper use Gus. Let me tell you about an example of the benefits. Last winter I was running in the place I usually go.......the woods are thick and deep, and are not accessible by vehicle as there are no trails, roads etc once you get off the one you came in on. I turned the dogs out (all wearing collars and trackers) and they got a hare up quickly and ran the best they could for a most of the morning. By lunch I'd had enough and when the dogs were at a loss I blew the horn and they all came in, right to me. Didnt even touch the e-collar trasmitter. Great example eh? I got lots more I could tell you about......... in fact just about one for every time I was out.gus wrote:Here is an example the dangers of shocking dogs to call them in. A couple years ago me and my buddy and I were out running our dogs. Soon we heard some other beagles running. As they circled their rabbit they came closer, then had a check. During the check they heard our beagles running and immediately came an joined. I noticed one or two had shock collars. After a few minutes the dogs indicated they were getting shocked severly. One would squall and come runnig toward one of us. He thought he was obeying his training in coming back to his master. Then he was shocked again, over and over. I could hear the other hunters calling the dog then he would shock him. The poor dog was so confused that he could not detect the distant voice. We walked quickly, about a quarter of a mile, toward the mans voice. When we got close enough we started yelling telling him to quit shocking the dog.
I suspect if a PETA or other animal rights individual had witnessed the episode the owner would have been dragged into court.
In flat land, calling the dogs with a shock collar may be an option. In mountains or hill country it's iffy.
It's not that life is short......it's just that we're dead for such a long, long time...
I have seen this example on more than one occasion. One example is when my brother and I were in about a 5 year old clear-cut and calling in his puppy. We were walking toward it and calling and the pup would be just as far away the same direction we were walking all the time until we got to the woodline at the far edge of the area. The pup was hearing our echo off the woodline and going towards it. As we moved, so did the echo. It made for some frustration on our parts. We had a tracking collar on him, so we were able to see exactly what was going on the whole time.I've already seen them run straight away from me thinking they where coming in, but they where running towards my echo.
Be ye kind one unto another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you. Ephesians 4:32
Sav, with beagles it's real easy to tell if you are doing the right thing. If you are having fun you are doing it right. When it stops being fun you need to change what you are doing.
I let some of my dogs out in the yard every day. I try to always put the e-collar on them before I let them out. When I come in the kennel with a bunch of collars they are all at the gate wanting me to put one on them. If you do this you never need to use a dummy collar. I quit using dummy collars back when I realized the dogs knew the difference between the two. The dummy collar never had that faint skunk smell on it!
I use the tone button a lot and it works very well for me. My dogs always return to where I let them out on the rare ocasion that they can't find me.
I believe using a horn is a good thing. I would use one myself but I know what would happen. The first time I pulled it out in front of my hunting buddies (a bunch of old redneck coonhunters like me) and started blowing on it they would look at each other and roll their eyes. Next time I am out in the brush trying to catch their dogs they would be back at the cabin eating all the food and telling stories about old Tom blowing on his horn. I think I'll pass on that one.
I let some of my dogs out in the yard every day. I try to always put the e-collar on them before I let them out. When I come in the kennel with a bunch of collars they are all at the gate wanting me to put one on them. If you do this you never need to use a dummy collar. I quit using dummy collars back when I realized the dogs knew the difference between the two. The dummy collar never had that faint skunk smell on it!
I use the tone button a lot and it works very well for me. My dogs always return to where I let them out on the rare ocasion that they can't find me.
I believe using a horn is a good thing. I would use one myself but I know what would happen. The first time I pulled it out in front of my hunting buddies (a bunch of old redneck coonhunters like me) and started blowing on it they would look at each other and roll their eyes. Next time I am out in the brush trying to catch their dogs they would be back at the cabin eating all the food and telling stories about old Tom blowing on his horn. I think I'll pass on that one.