LOOK,THIS IS WHY THE MOH'S HAVE A HARD TIME GETTIN JUDGES

[beagle crazy]

Danny, don't you "and your posse" normally take several dogs to club hunts? And haven't you shared the ride with a judge? And aren't some judges "your buddies"?

[RED BRUSH KENNELS]

danny,i was handling the time dog for ed in the cast that your talking about.i'm not going to get on here and put people down or take sides.time got a jump strike and a check.he was the blue collar dog.the yellow dog got a check,he is the one that won the cast.we were hunting in a spot that looked like a golf course with patches of brush in it.the grass was only about 2 inches tall.i was running right behind the judge.the dog's made a loss in front of the judge and the check was open.the yellow dog started pecking and working the track backwards.one other dog barked a few times with him.he never blew out he just kept hitting and pecking going back the same way that they had came.he went at least 50 to 75 yards and then just quit and went back to the check area.we were all standing there and there was no way the rabbit could have went back that way because i was standing there and it wasn't thick.you could see everything.we went across the road and it was really thick!!i stayed up on the judge and thought ed's dog got at least 3 checks.one of the checks was right in front of us and the judge.we got no checks.two of the checks that i thought he got were close.the dog's were running and went over a real thick high wall and had a check down on muddy field at the bottom.they had already ran that way once and brought it around the bottom of the hill and back on top.the check is at the bottom.the yellow dog comes back up the hill and starts barking at the top right where we were standing.we were standing where they went over the hill.he pull's dog's back up to him and the judge get's to the top and calls dead track and we move them and turn loose with 5 minutes left.no more score and the yellow wins 75 to 65 over the blue.i had never protested a cast until that day.i felt i had a good protest and the dog that won should have been minused.

[danny vansickle]

Danny, just a little bit of info for you, Myself along with my two brothers normally pack 3 to 6 dogs to each hunt we go to. The way I do the math thats 1 or 2 dogs each. We buy the gas to get them there and pay our entry fees, and we don't pack any judges with us to judge them. I am a friend of Ed Jones but I am nobody's Posse. As far as I can remember I've never done anything to you, or ask you to buy my gas or pay my entry fees so it's really none of your business how many dogs I run. Just a little quick advice, spend more time taking care of your own business and less worring about mine.

james,i wasnt ridin you man,all i am sayin is between you,your brothers,jason and ed,you all pack quite a few hounds,as far as packin judges,the only one that judges is jason and he is by far one of the best and most honest judges out there,all i was saying is,since you guys pack so many dogs to kliabers home club may have had a lil bit of influence on mike to not let jared judge..........

but,i acctually stand corrected,mike did not refuse jared to judge as i found out an hour ago,what hapopend was,the judges had already been paired up before jared got there,so,if jared blew up over not judging when they already had the judges they needed,then he was in the wrong there,but as far as him cheating,the call was a judgment call,who is to say the rabbit didnt go that way??????

if the dogs would have came back,then moved the line a different direction,then he could have minused them,but,they didnt.so,he made the right call,deal with it,and hopin to win on a minus is a long shot any way ya look at it.

i could see if he cheated ya out of a handfull of checks or somethin,but,whining over him not minusing a dog,read the rulebook,judge a few casts,you will see,he made the right call.


yes scotty,it is the same ed jones,the "preacher".

and beagle crazy,i ride alone man,ask anyone,when vansickle pulls up,i may have a handler,but that is it.

staten,i wasnt there man,but,i can only get second hand,bottom line,it was a judgment call,right?kliaber went with the judge,right?so,if you all are callin jared a cheater on this call,then your callin kliaber a cheater too,a judgment call is a judg=ment call,it sucks it happened at the world hunt and that late.but,it it what it is,a judgment call.

maybe jared made a mistake,does that make him a cheater??????????

[Murphy's Kennel]

I wasn't at the world hunt and was not at all taking up or downing anyone for an incident that happened there. But what I am going by is instances that have happened while Jarred judging with me in the past.I am pretty sure Mr. Mcallister is big enough to take up for hisself and that is all that I ever meant by him getting on the internet. But what I find funny is not the people who are putting people down but the ones who want to put people down because voicing their opinion. Which my opinion comes from year in year out instantces where I wasn't happy with Jarred's judging performances. I will be the first to say as I did earlier on this thread that I may have been wrong and that I am going to keep an open mind about Jarred. If GOD willing I'll be at the IN State where hopefully I get to watch Jarred judge or maybe get to get him as a judge. Because I believe everyone deserves another chance and I attend to exactly that and give him another chance with this peon(ME). Hopefully he will prove me wrong and if so I will be the first to admit it and tell him that I was wrong.n Cause Lord knows these short legs weren't made for running. As Jarred can do all day long. Hopefully Jarred will get to make it and if he or anyone else would like to discuss this as gentlemen then you are more then welcome to pull me to the side and we can discuss this as gentlemen.
Til Then,
Bryan Murphy

[RED BRUSH KENNELS]

no it wasn't a judement call.the rules say that a dog is to be minused for backtracking on a covered line if the dog goes at least 50 feet.he went 50 yards.i could see him not minusing the dog if we were in thick cover to where he couldn't see what was going on.we were chasing the dog's in a wide open field with hardly any cover.they made a loss in front of us.i stoped and started watching the dog's,the judge ran up to them.the check came open and then the dog started hitting backwards and went right pass me.there was no question as to what he did.and as far as having to win with a minus,the dog should have had a check that he didn't get.i think he made a couple bad calls and i told him that and i told the moh's!!!!wheather it helped or not i got my point across loud and clear to both of them!!!!!and if we want to talk some more about jared,he judged me in the 2nd round with the panama jack dog and tom floyed's woody dog.there was about 5 minutes left in the cast and jack was up 115 to 100 over woody.the dog's ran across a field and down a hill into a patch of woods.all the handlers were standing at the edge of the field and jared was down in the woods somewhere out of sight.woody came up out of the woods and barked 7 or 8 times and didn't go anywhere.jack opened up on top the hill in the woods and drove out and all the dog's fell in.jared came running up the hill trying to catch up to them and he said he got the check.he gave it to woody.woody was in front of all of us when jack drove out with it over the hill.that gave woody the win 125 to 115.i never said anything and shook his hand and everyone eles.that was a judgement call that would not have been overturned,even though it was clear what dog got the check and that jared wasn't there to give a score anyways.i don't like to call people names,i just say what i think and i'm not afraid to tell jared,mike kliber,or anyone else.if my dog get's beat fair,i don't have a problem.rules are rules,if a dog back tracks or pulls a dog out of the check area minues it!!!!the jack dog i was handling in the 2nd round got a minues for pulling out of the check area.he then grabbed the check.jared was judging it and he made the right call.i was told that the e-board or a member of the board made the decison not to let jared judge in the finals,because of all the protests and complaints that was made about him during the hunt.i'm not calling anyone names,i'm just telling what i saw.if anyone want's to talk to me in person,my name is mike staten and my number is 1-740-339-0518.

[mike crabtree]

Mike Staten HUh, I heard you liked little boys?????????

[RED BRUSH KENNELS]

only if there from virginia and run patch hounds!!

[mike crabtree]

Ill be down here waiting, I mean hiding from ya!!!!!!!!

[danny vansickle]

well,we can argue till we are blue in the face,it wont change anything,as far as the minus,i understand you when you say the dog may have backtracked,but,i cant count the times i have seen dogs double back on a line and the peel off and keep goin thinkin they had backtracked,i know you said you was on top of it,but,it only takes a split second for a rabbit to double back on a line.it can be missed.

if jared made a mistake,fine,no one is perfect,i recall a cast at oak hill that you was judgin mike with ogul jenkins dog,oguls dog had two minuses,sly was the dog,sly blew out and got on the clock,a dog or two babbled with him,you was tryin to see if they where goin to produce and ACCIDENTLY let the time run over 3 minutes,so,instead of sly getting his last minus right there and goin to the truck,you appologized like a man and said you made a mistake,sly went on to pull his 3rd minus and minus out right after that,but,if he hadn't,sly would have won the cast when he clearly didnt deserve it,some people could blow up and say you was a cheater and run you in the ground,i honestly think you made a simple mistake,but my point is,younfactor in the human eliment,anyone can mess up,no one is perfect.it happenes to the best of us.

the first big fiver i went to i made it to the semis of the opens,a dog left the country poundin somethin,the other 3 came back,the judge was tryin to see what the dog was on and accidently let the time pass 3 minutes,he could not honestly say the dog was offgame,so we went on,the owner of the dog that left came in with ten minutes left,the judge had to award the dog 10 points,the dog won the cast and went on to place top 5 in the nationals,my dog would have won on hunt and handling he said,but an honest mistake was made,i haeld that call againt that man for a year or so,now,i would pray that he is judgin my cast when the judges are read off cause he is one of the best in the arha.

no one is perfect,no one.


now i see why everyone rode my arse so bad last year about this time,i must have sounded pethetic,i want to appologize now for my actions last year,i can't believe i reduced myself tho the level of the things i am seeing now.

swing needs to call kleenex and see if they will double the supply of kleenex for the new format he is starting,

[Doug G.]

Danny for your info Jason is not related to James and his brothers. They are friends but rarely travel to hunts together. I know all of these guys well and feel that they are all good guys and shouldn't be drug into this topic because none of them have any involvement. No need to get innocent peoples names drug through the mud. I don't know what happened nor do I care but I don't want to see people get drug into it when they have no involvement in the matter.

[danny vansickle]

Danny for your info Jason is not related to James and his brothers. They are friends but rarely travel to hunts together. I know all of these guys well and feel that they are all good guys and shouldn't be drug into this topic because none of them have any involvement. No need to get innocent peoples names drug through the mud. I don't know what happened nor do I care but I don't want to see people get drug into it when they have no involvement in the matter.

whatever doug,i will appologize to james and jason now,yeah,i shouldnt have brought them into this,bottom line is if the call jared made was wrong,kliaber would have overturned it,but,he didnt.

i have took a piule of screwins from ed jones,as a metter of fact,there is a hole thread devother to his cheatin ways on here and i am goin to try and find it.

i have nothing against ed as a p[erson,but,when ya go out on 5 casts in a row and pick the winner,and watch your dog get score and still never hit the card,well,i have one thing to say to ed about that.................

KARMA IS A BIOTCH

[Doug G.]

Danny I'm not passing judgment on Jareds call because I was not there that is why I didn't comment on that aspect of this topic. I've judged enough myself to know that if your not there to see something it's hard to say what is right and what is wrong.

[PSM BEAGLES]

I dont like to bash judges, im a judge myself but calling it like it is doesnt have to be nice! In fact if everyone was nice no matter what was put on the scorecard how long could fieldtrailing last. Your always going to see the crybaby type that get mad every time they lose and sometimes your going to run into a judge that does a bad job or cheats. The worst judging that I have seen was cast 31 of the champs at the world hunt judged by J Mac. and im not the crybaby type I have lost plenty and had fun watching it happen but in my 10 years of field trials this was the first time that i refused to sign. I wont say He was cheating but i will say he done a terrible job. He broke no rules and as a MOH myself i knew how the protest would end up, he simply refused to score my dog so the MOH has to go with the judges opinon i would have had to do the same. My point is know the rules and dont back down from the truth.

[Hills Beagles]

Danny you are fighting a losing battle, it wasn't long ago you were on here complaining about Jared stiffing you on payment or a half ownership on dogs you were kenneling and running for him. You stirred all this up with your post. What is your reasoning for the change of heart and sudden defense of Jared? Has he taken up church and turned over a new leaf or has his judging just gotten better in your eyes . The thing is, it is easy to forgive but you can't forget what a person has done to you. I hope he can resolve the situations he has created, but he is going to have to do that himself. I don't think you want to be dragged down the same path he walks on. Just an opinion. Congratulations for your recent success.

Brandon Hill

[Chimney Rock Kennel]

The worst judging I have seen was cast 30 of the opens at the 08 world. It was flat out cheating, my dog didn't win the cast but the dog the judges brought back didn't win either. The only one to sign the score card was the handler of the dog that the judges brought back. I am not going to call the judges out by name but they know who they are.