Swing has been banned from the NKC/ARHA

Questions and Discussions about registry, rules and beagle field trialing in AKC. ARHA/NKC, CKC-Can, CKC-USA, PKC and UKC, etc.

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FLABSLAB
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Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 7:18 am

Post by FLABSLAB »

ps. I have heard this from multiple members at different times(3 to 4 individuals not in the presence of each other).....the deal with mace last year was xxxxxxx got a phone call from some people that left after the sat. hunt and said there was no use to stay for sun. hunt since they had already been cheated why spend more to get cheated again. When the members wanted to hold a meeting to change the appearance so nobody would even be able to make that accusation mace would not allow a meeting to take place. he held out til he could get del morgan and the board together and held the trial against dale barnes, randy beavers, and matt glomski. he accused them of being jealous and of his accomplishments and said they were basically working against him and his efforts to improve the pp division. mace had also got ahold of the people that called xxxxxxxxx and i believe scared them into saying they did not say anything. at the hearing mace brought papers in showing that the three in question had judged his dogs xxxx amount of times and never brought his dogs back a winner. evidently in his mind that was enough to prove they were conspiring against him. in no way is it possible his dogs never deserved it. i think alot of people are scared of mace due to him being a lawyer and the head of pp. the part i do not know for sure is ,,,,,, i heard that the person that brought him back winning both days rode to the hunt with him.

We caught them in more than 1 what ever you call it, a lie or typo or miscommunication and for that they banned us for life. I hope that the new format in ukc takes off.
I attended the meeting in which Mace did this. Everything you said here is true, except as you stated, I'm not sure if the judge rode to the hunt with Mace. I think he did, but I'm not sure.

That meeting was a joke. Del Morgan sat there himself and expressed his anger at having to come all the way to Indiana to straighten out a problem which should have been settled at a club level. I agree with him...it should have been settled at a club level. Problem was, Mace refused to have a club meeting. Of course, Del wouldn't acknoweldge that. Instead, the meeting turned into a "let me see what kind of dirt I can throw onto the table about these guys" meeting by Mace. He actually had the number of times Matt Glomski judged his dogs, and complained that Matt never brought his dogs back winning. Maybe, just maybe, Matt was honest enough to really bring back the best dog, and not bow to intimidation. Perhaps CC Hardtrack dogs aren't as solid as Mr. Clark thinks they are. I don't know. I do know that I'd let Matt judge my dogs anytime, anywhere. And I'd trust his judgement. In my opinion he has probably forgotten more about beagling than Mace will ever know.

Of course, Matt won't be judging in ARHA anytime soon. They pulled his liscense. For what, you might ask? Well, as I said, I attended the meeting. Mace accused him of saying "I will bring back the best dog, regardless of what the rules say". Matt admitted this. So, he was accused of undermining the PP "judge em by the rules" push.

Yeah, judge em by the rules, as long as it's my interpretation of those rules and you never question my interpretation. I feel he was attacked because, as Mace himself pointed out, he never brought back a CC Hardtrack dog as winner. Maybe, Mace, your dogs aren't as good as you think. (?)

Well, in the end, three people got banned. But, the problem remained.
Now, more are banned, but the problem remains. I resigned my position with Morgan County Beagle Club, and for that I was banned? Wonder who's next?

But the problem will remain.

That's just sad.

:roll:
Last edited by FLABSLAB on Fri Oct 21, 2005 9:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

WrongsideRandy
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Post by WrongsideRandy »

I dont think the judge rode with him to the hunt.

Dont forget the fact that an executive board member who knew the truth about what was said, resigned before the meeting in order to keep from having to be drug into this mess and caught between friends. I guess I can respect that........but dang he threw us(the people who pay the bills) under the bus. That guy knew the people said what they said and all he had to say was the truth.

Later all,
Randy

swing
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Post by swing »

Guys, I have been visiting with a Lawyer on the voteing that took place , where people was voted for in their names and wasnt even there.
May be a one man registry that the guy can control the registry because he is the owner but, the Lawyer is haveing issues with the voteing that took place where there was names forged to show they were there and voted for.
Things go good looks like I may be getting to meet Mr. Morgan and Mr. Clark and whoever they blame the forged signatures on before to long.
Wish me Luck.
Trent
Trent

No one plans to Fail, they fail to Plan

swing
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Post by swing »

Hey Mace ,
Answer this one for me.
The finals are ran at the U.S. championship, we have a winner, and come to find out the guy who judged the dogs was somewhat related to a owner to a dog that was in the cast, the cast was judged fair and the scorecard was signed with no protest, and then when all were back the cast is thrown out and re ran, but when it was time to re roll judges you and Mr. Ramsey spoke up and said there wasnt going to be a drawing for judges you and Mr. Ramsey would do the judging.
You all go out and pick up the dog who won the first time and bring back a winner of your choice.
Why do you guys keep giving them your money, its beyond me?
Trent

No one plans to Fail, they fail to Plan

Buckeye Bob
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Post by Buckeye Bob »

Let the games begin. :D

hubertsoutlaw
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Post by hubertsoutlaw »

Well Swing i'm sorry you are going though what i did. I have a dog lacking a win to champion. I'm not banned just don't think i want to go back. Try AKC I is a lot better format and you don't have the home cooking. You have Two judges, judging every cast instead 15 friends.



JEREMY Also AKA hubertsoutlaw

swing
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Post by swing »

Jesse Duncan
newbie


Reged: 11/09/04
Posts: 44
Loc: Martinville IN Re: Gunsmoke Rockin Rhonda - - Mike Burk [Re: mike b]
#4319 - 10/25/05 12:29 PM Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply



Hey Mike keep your head up, shes a nice hound! I heard she got picked up by mace and ramsey?? I judged her a few times and really liked her. I don't know how they could stay on them good enough threw that thick saresa grass to even pick up a hound?? I dont know its beyond me. I know I judged her on a pounded rabbit and I couldn't pick her up. Anyways keep your head up Burk. Jesse Duncan

Post Extras:

CC Hard Track
grand daddy


Reged: 11/01/04
Posts: 101
Loc: Spencer, Indiana Re: Gunsmoke Rockin Rhonda - - Mike Burk [Re: Jesse Duncan]
#4327 - 10/26/05 12:16 PM Edit Reply Quote Quick Reply



Dear Mr. Duncan: I didn't see you at the U.S. Championship this past weekend at Lynnville, IN. Were you there? Since you concluded in your post that "Mace" and "Ramsey" were not able to keep up with the hounds as they ran through the "saresa" [sp] grass you have suggested to people that you were out on that final cast. Again, I didn't see you there. Were you on that cast? Finally, you have suggested to folks that "Mace" and "Ramsey" did not judge that cast fairly. Of course had you been there you would know that the hounds were not run in thick "saresa" grass but instead were run in open fescue grass fields with briar patches with very little "saresa" grass. And you would also know that 3 judges, Ron Ramsey, Guy Russell and myself, judged that final cast according to the Progressive Pack rules. As has been suggested to you by Mr. Del Morgan, this board is not to be used as a tool for you further your own misplaced agendas by trashing people or hounds. Hopefully you will make the choice to comply with Mr. Morgan's directive. Mace Clark, Chairman of the Executive Board

Edited by CC Hard Track (10/26/05 12:21 PM)


Well looks like Mr. Duncan will be loseing his birthday with the rest of us, but for some reason that story got a little twisted around, funny how things change from one post to the next.
Another thing I have been wondering, I was wondering if I would have smelt a rat insted of smelling fish if I would have lost my birthday.
O well all is not lost, NKC still single registers dogs. LMAO
Go Stone Go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Trent

No one plans to Fail, they fail to Plan

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Hunter
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Post by Hunter »

Jesse Duncan
newbie


Reged: 11/09/04
Posts: 45
Loc: Martinville IN
Re: Gunsmoke Rockin Rhonda - - Mike Burk [Re: CC Hard Track]
#4333 - 10/26/05 09:31 PM
Edit post Edit Reply to this post Reply Reply to this post Quote Quick Reply Quick Reply

Mace,

Dear Mr. Duncan: I didn't see you at the U.S. Championship this past weekend at Lynnville, IN.

Yes Mace, you are right. Wonder why?


Since you concluded in your post that "Mace" and "Ramsey" were not able to keep up with the hounds as they ran through the "saresa" [sp] grass you have suggested to people that you were out on that final cast.

When did I say I was there?
All I said was judging in that grass is a hard thing to do.
Plus with the way the rabbits run down there and how hard the dogs run after them its hard for any one judge to stay on the dogs good enough to get three minus.

Finally, you have suggested to folks that "Mace" and "Ramsey" did not judge that cast fairly.

Where in my previous post did I say you didn't judge the cast fairly? Maybe you should point that out to me?

Of course had you been there you would know that the hounds were not run in thick "saresa" grass but instead were run in open fescue grass fields with briar patches with very little "saresa" grass. And you would also know that 3 judges, Ron Ramsey, Guy Russell and myself, judged that final cast according to the Progressive Pack rules.

Good for you. That is what you stress to every body, that if you don't minus dogs then you are not judging by progressive pack rules.

As has been suggested to you by Mr. Del Morgan,

When did Mr Del Morgan suggest to me personally,I think it's actually you trying to suggest to me. Are you trying to threaten me? Where in the rulebook does it say you can't express your feelings? The rules don't apply to every day free time.

this board is not to be used as a tool for you further your own misplaced agendas by trashing people or hounds.

Where did I trash people or hounds? Jesse Duncan

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Hunter
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Post by Hunter »

sorry double shot

swing
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Post by swing »

Guys heres another thot in the new format you all are working on.
Lets pay back top ten hoty hounds insted of just paying first place.
If you have to pay a little more to enter a hound in a hunt, do it that way , reward the guys who have traveled alot and have done good doing it.
Just a thot.
I still think the format would do better with a guy who was actually a hunter insted of a guy who just sets behind a desk.
Easier to relate to problems.
Just my opinion tho.
Trent
Trent

No one plans to Fail, they fail to Plan

swing
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Post by swing »

Wonder if after all the cards are on the table on Mace, if Del will have second thots on letting people back in that tried to inform him of what was going on.( The truth will eventually come out )
I will say this L.P. has it's problems but not near as bad as P.P. does.
I'd say there is some guys in the L.P. that would even go to fight for a guy if he was right, but P.P. I kinda doubt anybody is going to stand-up due to everyone who has stood up so far has been barred.
Trent

No one plans to Fail, they fail to Plan

WrongsideRandy
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Post by WrongsideRandy »

swing wrote:Wonder if after all the cards are on the table on Mace, if Del will have second thots on letting people back in that tried to inform him of what was going on.( The truth will eventually come out )
I will say this L.P. has it's problems but not near as bad as P.P. does.
I'd say there is some guys in the L.P. that would even go to fight for a guy if he was right, but P.P. I kinda doubt anybody is going to stand-up due to everyone who has stood up so far has been barred.
Trent.....I would almost bet my nads that the chit will hit the fan as soon as the run offs are over and them checks change hands, lol. Some guys are scared of their own shadows. Many guys are tough in private. Maybe when they have a US with 100 dogs..........they just may get the point!

I know I wouldnt go back to ARHA if they would invite me back, pay for my gas and entry and put me up in a motel and furnish me with a truck for the year!!!! They were wrong and someday they will see that. Sooner rather than later this will catch up with them.

Take care,
Randy

Aaron Bartlett
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Post by Aaron Bartlett »

Trent.....I would almost bet my nads that the chit will hit the fan as soon as the run offs are over and them checks change hands, lol. Some guys are scared of their own shadows. Many guys are tough in private. Maybe when they have a US with 100 dogs..........they just may get the point!
I agree Randy!
Crane Creek Kennels

FLABSLAB
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Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2005 7:18 am

Post by FLABSLAB »

WrongsideRandy wrote:
swing wrote: I know I wouldnt go back to ARHA if they would invite me back, pay for my gas and entry and put me up in a motel and furnish me with a truck for the year!!!! They were wrong and someday they will see that. Sooner rather than later this will catch up with them.

Ditto! Del, he doesn't care about what's going on as long as his supply of cash is flowing. That's obvious. Mace, well, he's got his own agenda, and most of us "defenders of truth" have seen that agenda played out in some form or another. I suspect that even when things change, and Mace is no longer chairman, it still will be full of strife and discord, simply because some guys think more of winning than they do of friendship or fairness.
Why do you think most of the guys won't speak up in public? Why did the guys from (?) talk of leaving that trial because they already knew who would win Sunday, but when called on it they balked? Randy, I know you think it's because they have no "nads", and that might be part of it. But the truth is they won't tell the truth because they are SCARED TO DEATH that they'll offend someone and that whomever they offend will be judging thier dog in the next trial. I really believe that is what keeps them quiet. I mean, look what happened to anyone who told the truth.
It's almost like the mafia. Anyone who dares not pay for "protection" gets to meet 3 or 4 thugs in a dark ally. Same thing here.

Brian

WrongsideRandy
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Post by WrongsideRandy »

FLABSLAB wrote:
Why do you think most of the guys won't speak up in public? Why did the guys from (?) talk of leaving that trial because they already knew who would win Sunday, but when called on it they balked? Randy, I know you think it's because they have no "nads", and that might be part of it. But the truth is they won't tell the truth because they are SCARED TO DEATH that they'll offend someone and that whomever they offend will be judging thier dog in the next trial. I really believe that is what keeps them quiet. I mean, look what happened to anyone who told the truth.
It's almost like the mafia. Anyone who dares not pay for "protection" gets to meet 3 or 4 thugs in a dark ally. Same thing here.

Brian
Brian......The thing people must understand is that when you call someone your friend........you don't just throw them under the bus because of fear. I have friends I would fight for just like they were my wife or children. I have had a debate in my inner soul for over a year now and I think its time I stop covering up for people who betrayed me. Someday soon I am gonna stop protecting the people who started and fed this and start calling them by name on this site so everyone knows what's up. I don't know if this is the right thing to do or not for I still consider them people my friends, but they let me down........can I really justify in doing unto others as they have done to me :???: Or will that make me as bad as them........since I would be throwing friends under the bus?

Sadly, I was offered a deal months before the meeting where Shannon and myself could have stepped out of this conflict and not been a part of the meeting. I didn't take the offer because friendship and loyalty means more to me than running dogs in a crooked organization. I made the HOY run offs in 2 classes with culls, which was my goal when I started running in the ARHA. I just wanted to stand in that group on Friday morning......and I did. Now of course the cheap certificate wasnt worth much but man the feeling was well worth that $25,000 and to know that Del, Mace or the ARHA cant take it away is icing on the cake!

Take care,
Randy

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